Yellowcard Band • Page 357

can we please not try and defend adtr here jesus

 

"whataboutism" would be defensive. im not defensive; im stating that the scene as a whole does a better job at accountability than other scenes or groups. im NOT using that as a defense of what ADTR did or whatever - I've literally never listened to their music. I don't care about them (the band; not the victims). I have no desire to pick a fight. I would just like to see this thread refocus.

 

Car accident caused by reckless driving that killed someone which the band has successfully covered up for the most part. I could give too shits about the bands marketability when it comes to that. If you read reports, Josh refused blood tests at the scene and lawyered up immediately. Dude crossed over three lanes and his a parked vehicle killing an innocent person. Zero accountability when it comes to that and that’s not even talking about the many SA allegations over the years.

 

cmon guys let’s just celebrate the fact that yellowcard has new music out and the lead singer be getting dat bag.

 

I dunno...I'm not a huge YC fan (basically I like a few of the singles that have been released over the years) so i don't feel the need to defend them as some hardcore fan...But this definitely comes off as a "different people draw the line at different places" thing to me. If the ADTR guy isn't in the band anymore and it's been like 4-5 years since he left, why can't Yellowcard tour with them? Because we're assuming they either knew about it or didn't fire him right away or something? Idk...People do weird shit for people in their lives that they care about. Including believing them when they deny an allegation of something. I don't hold that against other people when they do that initially, or at least not to the point where I would refuse to associate with them years later because of it. For other people, I can totally get why they would do so, and why it disappoints them that Yellowcard isn't drawing the same line they are.

I think there are places where the line is more clear (like if the dude was still in the band, that's an obvious "what the fuck are you doing touring with them" moment IMO, and probably would be to most reasonable people who haven't completely buried what was left of their empathy or are just "anti-woke" because they're shitheads), and then there are places like this where more people will be okay with it and the line on what truly is/isn't the "right thing to do" is more blurred. The best course of action to take in those types of cases, IMO, is to not treat the people on the other side like they're out to get you or being an asshole. Try giving the benefit of the doubt and realizing that those thoughts and feelings might come from legitimate feelings/past experiences (i.e. folks who have been abused/have experience with abusers!) and thus their feelings on it might rightly be stronger/more passionate, and thus they might come on "strong" in their condemnations. Try to give them a little grace if you can! You don't have to agree with them, but also maybe don't assume they're just being overbearing scolds or whatever. On the other side of things, realizing that these grey area situations means folks will feel differently about where to draw the line, and that they might not match up exactly with your expectations, means you should try as hard as you can (which can be really hard to do when you or a loved one has been a victim to the same crime!) to give a little grace and not immediately assume the folks in question don't support victims or wouldn't make different choices in different circumstances.

But the folks like Yellowcard shouldn't be surprised if some just can't bring themselves to do so, and should accept it as a consequence, when dealing with something like this. Sexual abuse, statutory rape, grooming, etc. are just not things that are easily glossed over, especially when there's been so many cases of the people around the abuser protecting them/maybe even enabling them. To Ryan's point, we can't know what really went on there behind the scenes after the allegations surfaced, but to the folks arguing with Ryan's point--there's too many examples in other cases for folks to want to give the other ADTR members the benefit of the doubt. I know that's a LOT to think about and consider, but I do think these discussions would go much better if people tried to remember those things before jumping in to comment.

Sorry this post is so long.

 

David bringing that “to be fair” energy over from the politics thread lmao

 

I'm sorry what I meant to say was "Fuck you!"

 

Thank you for circling back and directly acknowledging people's concerns. I think it’s important that we all have a mutual understanding of each other, especially with a topic this serious, and it's good to get perspective from someone in the industry.

I think the feeling at this point is less about the member and more about how complicit the remaining members were or are in how things transpired. It's not hard to look at how they handled a situation and be concerned about their own character. And everyone's mileage will vary on what appropriate accountability looks like.

 

cmon now david this isn’t the sports corner

 

David is such a fucking teacher.

I don’t say that to dismiss anything you said, David. Haha but huge teacher vibes there.

 

And that'd be privilege. There are fans here who have valid reservations about supporting a band or a tour because their tourmates have seemingly done fuck all to try and distance themselves from their founding band member other than letting him leave quietly. I haven't gone back to see if ADTR ever did some sort of statement at the very least to acknowledge the allegations and support the victims. Maybe someone who follows them can update us.

I can only share my story here as I've done a bunch of times whenever Yellowcard comes up. My entire adult life is entirely different without the existence of this band. 20+ years ago, I had an extra ticket to one of their shows and joined their old message board to find it a new home. They were small-ish then, enough to the point where the band members and their friends posted there. I volunteered to sell shirts on Warped for one of them. I ended up finding a bunch of lifelong friends there, one of which is now my wife. Our son is now 8 years old and is really getting into the bands we've been listening to his whole life, Yellowcard included. We've floated the idea of taking him to see them live as sort of a full circle moment as without them, he likely wouldn't exist. That's huge to me so please excuse me if I have some concerns about a tour that at first glance doesn't really sit well with me given the presumed headlining act's reputation (let alone their producer's history of threatening to put a bullet in the head of his ex-wife, but that's an entirely different story).

 

THe teacher energy I aspire to:


The teacher energy I apparently actually am:

 

feel like you’re just pigpiling now

 

respectfully disagree and now remembering why I've been a member since 2016 and never posted. enjoy the day y'all. I'll see myself out.

 

Because you can't handle having a conversation with other people?

 

Just wanted to say this story is very sweet and I'm happy for your family!

 

Dude called everyone weird and got offended that people didn't like that and left when they made him feel bad :(

Anyway I'm good leaving it there (if you're not that's cool too though), I'm glad WRK said something about how it was addressed, will probably make their fans feel better in general and if they don't then it is what it is and that is alright too. Discussion likely only gets worse from here

 

Appreciate the insight. I’m not an ADTR fan, so playing catch up on the details.

Found an article mentioning the multiple allegations for those interested. A Day to Remember Bassist Announces Departure From Band Following Pressure Over Past Allegations

 

But that’s why i said what I said elsewhere in the post about people believing their friends and loved ones initially. Did he tell them he was innocent? Did he admit to it to them? Did they know? I assume that’s what Ryan meant by not knowing what was going on behind the scenes. Defending is almost always going to be everyone’s first reaction if they think someone they love has been falsely accused. Being dicks about it is either a huge personality flaw at best or a huge red flag at worst, but does it mean bands shouldn’t tour with them years later? That’s where I think there’s a lot less agreement among people.

Also I only remember reading about it a while ago and not really following because I don’t like ADTR, but my understanding of the timeline was the allegations came out like right during the start of Covid, and then he was out of the band when touring and all that started up again the fall after vaccines. It would make sense that the calls for accountability and allegations would die down when the whole world was shut in and bands weren’t touring anyway and people were just trying not to die. Maybe they should have kicked him out sooner, but if he was lying to them about what happened at all and then they weren’t together making music anyway, it’s not hard to see why it didn’t happen until the allegations resurfaced as tours started to get announced. All that to say I get why a band wouldn’t shun touring with them, even if it’s not the choice I would personally make. But I do think that band should be ready to accept that some of their fans are going to be very not happy about it, at the very least.

 

Can’t wait to discuss the music

 

Wrong website buddy

 

we can start right now! I think I like Better Days more so far, but honestly i is special in its own right. It's so very rare for bands to come back and still have it, especially to this extent. I never doubted YC, it's just an uncommon thing. In a similar way to Childhood Eyes, these tracks (and probably the whole record) sound both so familiar and so new. It's an incredible blend. I've been listening all day

 

this is an awesome story. I used to post a ton on the YCMB way back in the OFTK days and met a couple people in real life 20 years ago. i didnt know that board led to any marriages/kids though. pretty awesome. i would guess we probably exchanged lots of messages to each other back in the day.

 

How dare you talk about YELLOWCARD music in the YELLOWCARD thread!