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The Specific Betrayal of Brand New

Discussion in 'Article Discussion' started by Melody Bot, Nov 17, 2017.

  1. Melody Bot

    Your friendly little forum bot. Staff Member

    This article has been imported from for discussion. All of the forum rules still apply.

    Zoe Camp, writing for The Outline:

    There are those desperately searching for an argument that will let them reconcile their love of Lacey’s art with the admitted events, or offering limp defenses of his actions by noting that of course a teen girl would want to exchange flirty photos with a rock star, never mind the myriad reasons why a grown man is supposed to know better. (Equally toxic have been the invocations of Lacey’s mental health as excuses for his indiscretion, suggesting that he just couldn’t help himself.)


    The bleeding heart angst of emo’s singers leaked down to its boy fans; just ask any female emo fan about her experience with the men who treated them worse than the jocks they supposedly despised for being uncouth. It’s depressingly unsurprising now when a powerful man is revealed as having acted shittily toward the women around him, and less so when he comes from an environment as male-focused as emo – even when it’s somebody who was supposed to be as thoughtful as Lacey.

    There’s been a swath of these articles written today and I recommend reading them all. Over the past few days I’ve received countless emails and messages from people wanting to talk about the rot at the heart of our music scene. I’ve heard from people who were abused by some of the more well-known frontmen in the scene, but aren’t ready to come forward yet. And I’ve heard from many that are. We, as a community, are going to need to face all of this head-on and come to terms with our own culpability as well.

    I also want to say I am extremely disappointed that Brand New (with or without Jesse’s name attached) have not come out and asked their fans to not harass the women that have come forward with their stories. This has led to conspiracy theories spreading, harassment, and some truly disgusting behavior. Bands, labels, and all those associated with artists or celebrities need to know that part of their job when something like this comes out into the open is to make sure they’re active in the process. You can’t be silent while someone is re-victimized and think you’ve taken the moral high-ground. I believe it’s important to use your power and platform for good, and healing, not just when you want to sell records.

    SlappinCups, fenway89, dylan and 2 others like this.
  2. chewbacca110

    He wrenches on it. He thinks it's his.

    I do not understand the lack of a statement from the entity that is Brand New. Is it possible they thought Jesse's statement was sufficient? Did they themselves learn about this the same way we all did?
    Saephon likes this.
  3. SuNDaYSTaR


    I have to say that I'm kinda disappointed in a lot of members of this community, especially on Facebook. Realizing that a sizeable chunk of the people you assumed were more progressive-thinking aren't any different from your run-of-the-mill mansplainer/victim-shamer out there is very, very depressing.
  4. Serenity Now

    deliver us from e-mail Supporter

    I'm curious on this as well.
    It could be that they all want to retain their extremely private lives in some way.

    Not defending the decision, but given how reclusive this band generally is, they could think Jesse's personal statement is enough given how exposed it was compared to the band's overall character.
  5. _unproductive


    1. I wish this was longer. The writer started hinting at so much, and it feels incomplete.

    2. The design/layout of that site is awesome. Good design is good.
  6. Saephon


    I never found Brand New's elusiveness/lack of public engagement interesting or attractive back when they were at the height of their career; I find it despicable at this point in time, given how many people are hurting right now. The time to completely drop the mysterious facade and be upfront with fans was a week ago, and each day that goes by in silence is a day I get angrier.
    Raku, Jacob Davidson and RileyWitiw like this.
  7. WHAT?

    I hate it with an unbridled passion. Every time their fucking animated squiggle shit happens or it jacks my scrolling I want to throw something through a wall. One of the sites I have set to default in Reader View.
    TrueBlue, wearethedead and Dog Fish like this.
  8. _unproductive


    omg.. i love the squiggle

    i didn't have issues with scrolling, so no comment on that
  9. RileyWitiw

    more like Supporter

    I was really hoping for a second statement to further address this situation. If Jesse was listening to the response at all, it should be clear his first statement wasn't enough. When the only people defending you are fans using blatantly mysongistic logic, you should know you fucked up.
    skogsraet and Jason Tate like this.
  10. crunchprank Prestigious

    Jason it says a lot about you (and the other contributors) and what you're doing here on Chorus for these people to be coming to you about serious topics like the state of the music scene and being abused/victimized. Thank you for using your platform to educate and call for positive change regarding women and abuse in this culture.
  11. Martina Nov 18, 2017
    (Last edited: Jun 11, 2018)


    Well, there's an obvious reason why the band/artist in question doesn't issue a more satisfying admission of guilt and repentance / reconciliation / restoration, like an secular take on the Catholic "Act of Contrition" (see Act of Contrition - Wikipedia ) ... it's called "civil liability." It's the same reason after a car accident one isn't supposed to say "I'm sorry" whatever one has done but instead identify oneself, render first aid if needed, and call the police.

    I know that's not a satisfying or acceptable answer. I could write an essay on why the offending artist / motorist could and should say and do something more satisfying to the accusing party/parties -- and obviously we're into a spate of articles from people doing just that, to critical acclaim, as you see here.

    But that's a truthful answer, and likely why Jessie Lacey / Brand New / and their PR / legal team they may as well have leased on credit from The Weinstein Company (as in Harvey Weinstein's former company) has done exactly what they have done, and why they may do nothing more.

    It's almost certain that the people doing the worst harassment aren't the biggest Brand New fans anyway and may be more encouraged than discouraged from harassing the accusers the more Brand New / Jesse Lacey talks about this at all, ESPECIALLY the harassment. The more that ANYONE -- including "Brand New" -- uses the press or social media to call out harassment against the accusing party/parties/victims/survivors the more trolls they'll draw towards the accusers. That doesn't mean that "Brand New" (whatever that is, besides Jesse) shouldn't say anything more than they have, but again it's hard to imagine anything short of some secular Act of Contrition that's really going to satisfy anyone critical of the behavior Jesse's been accused of.

    Good idea.

    How about someone do some in-depth analysis, naming names, of how business interests like the PR/label/legal team supported Jesse/ Brand New and what they've done or havent done related to his abusive behavior or history, rather than more dissection of exactly what Jesse did or said?

    I know Jesse Lacey did wrong. I know, with far more evidence, that Harvey Weinstein (or for that matter, from a few years ago, Jake McElfresh) did wrong. But on a different scale all had and still have help from highly educated and specialized staff supporting them.

    Harvey Weinstein had the best team defending him that money, legal counsel, and human resources bureaucracy could offer. Indie labels, on a garage band scale, appear to offer similar protection and they aren't worried about the New York Times or Ronan Farrow exposing them.

    Why do we talk so little, if at all, about the individuals and the organizations involved, the messages or the money flow, engaging those who collude with and enable abusers?

    It seems like it's easier to take money and support from the institutions that are party to enabling and colluding with the abusers to produce something like The Hunting Ground (Weinstein) or some music industry harassment awareness project (Pure Noise Records, and others). It's harder to document and criticize their enabling and collusion when they are supporting such worthwhile causes.

    We're going to continue supporting, calling out, and then forgetting more Jesse Laceys, Harvey Weinsteins, and for that matter Jake McElfreshes as if there is a revolving door attached to the stages they are on if we can't or don't talk about how they are supported in acting as they have.
    elemenohpe and Ska Senanake like this.
  12. elroyo


    no proof but after seeing mike herrera in vegas on their tour with lagwagon in '08 im almost sure we'll hear something about him with minor(s)
  13. Ska Senanake


    Ever since the news broke about Jesse I've had this hole in my gut and it absolutely will not shake. Might not even be able to listen to brand new ever again, they were my heroes and were the band i told all my friends to check out who weren't into this kind of music. I really hope all victims of sexual misconduct (by celebrity or not) have the courage to come out and we see a real culture shift because this mistreatment and degradation of women is keeping me up at night and making me sick to my stomach. Not sure if anyone is following the Chrissie Bixler story but holy shit.
    fenway89 and teebs41 like this.
  14. _unproductive


    I've always seen rumors about him floating around, but no one ever came forward with an accusation.
  15. ihaveblink


    whoa, never heard that.
  16. St. Nate

    من النهر إلى البحر Prestigious

    I hate this site's lack of squiggle. I demand squiggle. I'll even become a supporter for squiggle.
    Serenity Now likes this.
  17. slimfenix182


    Chorus def needs more squiggles and quotes of the day
  18. sammyboy516

    Trusted Prestigious

    Can you elaborate on this at all? Never heard this
  19. elroyo


    just his demeanor at the show i was at. after their set they went around and chatted with the crowd a bit. Yuri and Tom were great but unless you were a young girl Mike would hardly utter a hello.
  20. sammyboy516

    Trusted Prestigious

    Not trying to be difficult and I would never do anything to discredit someone who came forward about him but no one has and that’s a pretty bold accusation, especially if that observation is all you’ve got
    slimfenix182 likes this.
  21. elroyo


    i never accused him, just wouldn't surprise me based on his demeanor
  22. sammyboy516

    Trusted Prestigious

    That’s fair, accusation was the wrong word. Just seems unfounded based on what you say you saw and I was unable to find anyone saying anything similar about him anywhere else. I’m not looking for an argument I was just curious why you thought he may be guilty of doing inappropriate things with minors. In this era of so many people actually being guilty of that type of horrible behavior it just seems like a big thing to say that about someone without anything substantial to back it up. Doesn’t mean it isn’t true.
    slimfenix182 likes this.