Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker (J.J. Abrams, December 20, 2019) Movie • Page 245

i'd absolutely wear that lol

 

Rey ignites the purple saber in front of the emporer.

“This party’s over”

 

Shouldn't it be "Written and Directed," though?

But, yeah, I'd 100% rep that.

 

Let's try to get some positivity back... we're basically a week out from TROS!!

 

post the link for the sweatshirt when it drops

 

I think the reaction to that JJ quote is a little overblown, he hasn't been gushing over Rian but he's has shown admiration for the bold choices in most interviews. Knowing the question asked that prompted the 'meta' response would help provide some actual context (the article isn't a great read, in my opinion). I bet that the question leading up to that quote was asking him why he thinks some fans hate the movie and JJ simple offered a theory (of course I'm completely guessing there). Probably should have bit his tongue, but whatever. I love TLJ and TFA.

Unfortunately, I feel like no matter the response to TROS, TLJ will continue to get thrown under the bus. If it's the best Star Wars movie ever (or just really good) people will be like, "amazing that JJ was able to save the franchise". If it's terrible or mediocre, people will say, "well, what did you expect after TLJ, there was no way to dig out of that hole!"

 

Though from the article, I've been saying this over and over to the "they didn't have a plan!" crowd:

I really don't care if JJ had big plans for Snoke or if Rey was Luke's daughter or whatever. Rian had a better idea and Lucasfilm agreed. Having an airtight plan doesn't mean the plan is good.

 

This is exactly how I feel. Definitely think a lot of the responses I've seen from both TLJ fans and detractors to that quote have been reactionary. It's a VERY diplomatic answer, especially when viewed in the context of everything else he's said about the movie. Like you, I'd also like to know how the question he was responding to was phrased.

 

I can’t remember the last time pos-neg takes of a director’s work was getting this much traction. The pos-neg Johnson debate has to be more than just subjective opinions on art right? It seems very political with both sides trying to prove a political point with whoever wins. Could anyone fill me in if this is the case?

Just my observation from being on Twitter today.

 

Personally I think the toxic side of the Star Wars fanbase really coming out in their hatred of TLJ has made it more of a "political" debate. The most obnoxious haters of the movie are absolutely angry at what they perceive as "SJW themes" and minority representation in that movie, so I definitely understand why a lot of the movie's defenders have no patience for it.

That being said, I'd argue that the (much milder) flip side is that there's been so much toxicity that now any online critique of TLJ, regardless of the substance/reasoning, gets lumped in with the most toxic fanboys by some Johnson fans. Because of that, it does feel to me like each side is trying to score points in service of their larger viewpoint instead of listening to each other... so yeah, basically like politics.

 

You know who sticks to their original idea no matter what? Those morons who made How I Met Your Mother. I wonder how that turned out.

 

That’s what I was thinking but I wasn’t sure if I was just connecting dots in my head for no reason. Thanks.

 

Most people’s reasons for not liking TLJ are dumb or just plain aren’t accurate. Like one in a hundred makes a valid point. I would respect them way more if they just said it didn’t work for them. But instead they come up with all this bullshit that’s just not true.

 

I'm honestly just a fan of the sequel trilogy overall... I think Abrams and Johnson have both done great, Disney has handled the franchise extremely well overall, and I'm really excited to see the conclusion to the Skywalker saga. I really hope the fanbase isn't even more divided now to the point where this becomes a "controversial" take... the whole conversation on Twitter today has been bumming me out.

 

I'll never forgive this show for how it ended. It's one of my all time favorites, but I've never been so angry with a piece of entertainment media before.

 

So much of art is subjective though. We can all recognize that certain decisions were made in a piece of storytelling while disagreeing on the impact of said choices, or the interpretation of what those choices mean thematically. Obviously there are still "wrong" interpretations of a work of art, but I do personally think there's a broader spectrum of "right" opinions that can disagree with each other than you're letting on. It's not like we're solving a calculus problem and there's one right answer.

 

Same. I adored that show through sometime in season 7. Then it was okay and that final season was hot garbage with a shit cake for a finale.

 

But sometimes it is depending on context. Like the people who yelled that their Luke wouldn’t done the projection and would have really gone to kickass. They’re wrong. Luke learned at the end of ROTJ where that path leads. What he did fits perfectly with the Luke at the end of the OT.

could it have been done differently? Of course! But a lot of people’s points are not about how something was done, it’s about whether it fits. I’m sorry, but most of the haters of TLJ are wrong almost all the time.

like I said, I’d respect them saying it didn’t work for them. Or they wish Luke’s story was different. Totally fair. But that’s absolutely not what I generally see.

 

Art is subjective and objective.

 

I'd love to see an alternate timeline where a child was shown the prequel trilogy & nothing else. Then, shown the original trilogy in adulthood, decades later. What would this child's reaction to Obi-Wan & Yoda be?

 

Those bureaucrats sure fucked up the galaxy nice and good.

 

Counterpoint: Luke dribbles blue milk on his beard while being cranky and my childhood is ruined.

 

I certainly agree with you on the point of Luke. I do think some of the criticisms (especially pertaining to his arc) show a lack of real understanding of the themes of the OT and how TLJ connects to them. So I do get where you're coming from.

Personally though I've seen a good amount of both of those categories of criticisms you're referring to... note that I'm not counting the toxic trolls who are arguing in bad faith. I do think the way an argument is made matters, because like you said if someone is arguing something "doesn't fit" it definitely opens that argument up to factual error. But if I say: "the Canto Bight sequences were the least interesting part of The Last Jedi for me, and the Rey/Luke/Kylo sections were far more compelling"... that isn't factually wrong. A lot of you might disagree with me, and fair enough! I'm glad you enjoyed that part of the movie more than me. But I think those types of criticisms are fair game, and that kind of gets to my point of them getting lumped in with the trolls.