Riot Fest Announces First Wave of Bands • Page 7

Also this is probably won't go over well.

I love the community but sometimes I just want to talk about the music and not hear about the politics / band member shit (which is awful) in every thread. It is a little draining to constantly see the same arguments had over and over when people just want to talk about the music.

 

If it's draining to hear arguments about a lack of female representation, imagine what it's like to be a female punk fan lol just a random thought!

 

Agree. I don't know how that feels. And can't. But I do empathize with folks that have to deal with that.

Don't want to stop conversation but wonder if the same comments over and over in a large majority of threads is having the effect people intend. Again my vantage point that is about as privileged as possible on almost any issue about anything. Ha

 

Why do these kinds of people never have profile pictures

 

Happy?

 

Generally yes, but decidedly not when reading your posts. As such I'm going to direct this towards all the ghosts and lurking men chomping at the bit to create accounts and chime in:

Listen I recognize that it does nothing but infuriate cis men (and particularly white, cis men) that their opinions are completely worthless when it comes to the subject of gender representation, but please hear me clearly when I say that women could not fucking care less. You wanna come up in here and fuckin get into it with Jason, pretend it's the fuckin reddit male "feminist" dick measuring championship be my guest. Jason is more than qualified to tell you when you're being a piece of shit. Not dragging him at all, but it's not a fucking hard concept to grasp. The music scene, universally, is a cesspool of festering, toxic male garbage when it comes to gender relations and if you feel differently, again, no one fucking cares. Either listen and learn or sod the fuck off.

 

Not from the U.S., but in Denmark it is a common discussion in the media it after festival line-ups are released. Bookers are asked about it in interviews every year essentially. The biggest festival in the country, Roskilde Festival, went from roughly 18% women in 2015 to 25% last year and then to 30% this year (with 175-ish artists). Still a long way to go, but public discussions are there and have definitely helped.

 

There's more important things to discuss in this thread than a Jawbreaker reunion

 

The issue is that chorus is a platform that can be used to promote female musicians, but instead of being supportive it just places blame.

 

"Chorus is a platform that can be used to promote female musicians!"

*starts conversation about the lack of diversity on a major music festival*

"No not that! You're just placing blame!"

 

For real, here people are trying to promote and explaining how to promote female musicians. Bunch of blockheads in this thread stuck in "Well, that's just the way things are!" train of thought.

If someone is telling you that there is a problem with Riot Fest's lack of diversity in their lineup and you are arguing against them, you may want to take a step back and realize that you may be a part of the problem.

 

Instead of telling people there is a problem use the resources available to offer a solution. Hire paid female staff, review albums by female musicians, conduct interviews with female musicians, have female guests on the podcast, accept advertisements from female musicians, sponsor female based organizations, create charity opportunities with proceeds going to female organizations, provide praise for events/labels/companies that support gender equality, include more women in year end lists and anticipation lists, include year end and anticipation lists from female contributors, direct users to organizations that support gender equality.

 

http://pitchfork.com/features/festi...l-lineups-getting-worse/?mbid=social_facebook

this has some diversity analysis

 

chorus isn't perfect (hell, i looked at the last couple pages of news and it's sooooo predominately male and there are so many acts i know that have put out new songs in the last week personally that i consider far better than a lot of the trash posted in there that aren't all men) but at least jason acknowledges it and knows it's a work in progress and doesn't pretend like there isn't an issue

 

16 years should be enough time to get it right.

 

Jason has not denied criticism or the fact that he can do better. However, criticism of him or this site does not invalidate criticism of Riot Fest or diversity in music and festivals in general.

Especially if such criticism is used to deflect rather than engage the issue.

 

All you are doing is deflecting the issue at hand. Jason has acknowledged criticisms of this site and AP numerous times even in this thread. Pointing it out further is not "offering a solution." Instead you are "placing blame" in the wrong direction.

 

This whole thread is him adamantly denying criticism and insisting that he is making a more concerned effort than riot fest to be gender inclusive.

I'd have a lot more respect for him if he stated that his organization has failed to address the gender inequality in the music scene that he covers and will work to make improvements.

And then include more than 10% female artists in the staff top albums of 2017.

 

No, I'm creating a conversation.

 

You are creating a conversation over a separate conversation we were having about the same issue. Except instead of trying to promote women, you are trying to put down one man in charge of a website.

 

About half the news posts on the last two pages include stories about females. I wouldn't call that predominately male. I aim for 50% a day (stories about, written by, or including not white men), and usually get pretty close depending on the news out there each day. I'd venture I got close to 40% for the first year.

 

No, you're deflecting, and using "whataboutism" to do it, which I believe is a logical fallacy.

That being said, I have literally seen Jason say elsewhere the things you're saying you wish he said.

 

You know I'm one person and this website doesn't even make enough money to support me alone .... right? lol. And I still do literally all the things listed here. I've literally done every single one.

 

of course there's random variation and this could be a down day, and it's hard to count things, but at least on the last three pages it's not close to 50% (i only went through bands, ignored non music posts, and didn't look at writers of articles, included duplicates, and may have missed some so it's not perfect). and bands (and not even necessarily obscure bands, bands that are well known or on labels relating to the "scene") like waxahatchee, ratboys, charly bliss, frankie cosmos, cayetana, for everest, eskimeaux have had new songs/big band news in the last week and didn't get posted. i totally understand it's just you doing it and i know it's a lot of work and you can't catch everything, plus it's a small sample size, but i'm not sure it's really as good as you think. aiming for 50% is a great mentality to have but based on the little bit of (flawed) research i did i'm not quite sure it's there.

i'm not doing this to get on your case, this isn't a you thing, and i'm sure a lot of the relationships with labels you've formed from the AP time and the AP scene have influenced a lot of what you post, but we can all try a bit harder

 

Well, go back and look and don't ignore those things and it'll change the math. And if you look at my goal of non straight white men, it's even higher.