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Moose Blood Release Statement • Page 3

Discussion in 'Article Discussion' started by Melody Bot, Feb 23, 2018.

  1. AshlandATeam Feb 24, 2018
    (Last edited: Feb 24, 2018)
    AshlandATeam

    Trusted

    This situation seems a little unique in that it feels like the victim should be able to prove what happened. This is a person whose job it is to sell pictures of herself; she surely has detailed records of who does and doesn't have access to those photos. If they have something that they don't have a receipt/evidence of a subscription for, it should be pretty open and shut. Same thing if they have photos she was NOT selling; pretty obviously, those weren't meant for the general public. It feels pretty likely that her photos are easy to trace, given who she is and what she does.

    The theft part of this seems to add a layer of both grossness and criminality. It's not just sexual here; they went after her livelihood, because clearly they felt entitled to have what they wanted without having to pay. It's shitty on several levels. I hope she gets justice - no one deserves to be sexually violated, and no one deserves to have their means of honest, legal income attacked or robbed from them. They did both to her.
     
  2. teebs41

    Prestigious Prestigious

    Wtf
     
    Kingjohn_654 likes this.
  3. RiseAgainst379

    Regular

    I can only assume this is a defamation suit. Though laws vary by state, in general, accusing someone of sexual misconduct is "Defamation Per Se," where damages are assumed. What Is Defamation Per Se?.

    In that case, the defendant's (victim's) only defense from liability is proving the truth of what she said. Think about that. Instead of the law forcing the perpetrator to prove why the victim's statements AREN'T TRUE (which would make sense, wouldn't it??), we instead force victims to prove in court that their statements ARE TRUE. It's completely backwards.

    Listen, I'm a lawyer. I get it. Defamation is a handy cause of action because sometime people say truly heinous things and deserve to held responsible for the damage that causes (Envision your co-worker falsely accusing you to your boss of stealing shit from work - your co-worker should be responsible for the damage arising out of that lie). But if we're not going to revamp criminal law to deal with sexual crime, we need to revamp civil law to at least grant accusers protection to speak out. Because right now it's fucked both ways.

    </rant>
     
  4. emeryk3

    Wharf Mice

    Except that's the same rationale I've heard right-wingers use for cops shooting black people, ie "Blacks are killed disproportionally but look at the crime rates for black-on-black crime!".

    You still judge cases individually, no matter the crime. Otherwise it's not a fair trial.
     
  5. emeryk3

    Wharf Mice

    You're assuming a party is guilty solely by statistic, from crimes they're not associated with. Sit down.

    You haven't got a better solution. Make the system work better in their favor to handle more of these cases. No doubt it can do better but you haven't given a bette solution. No, I'm not just gonna join your ideas to assume a party is guilty by association? Like wtf? I don't care what you say. That's not rationale just because, "yeah but statistics show...".
     
  6. Jesse West

    Cursed by my ancestry

    Through all of this you've missed one very
    VERY
    important fact.

    We're not in a fucking court.
     
    Aaron Mook likes this.
  7. emeryk3

    Wharf Mice

    Then all you have is an opinion. Not a verdict.
     
  8. Jesse West

    Cursed by my ancestry

    NO

    FUCKING

    SHIT
     
    Aaron Mook and Butinsmallsteps like this.
  9. emeryk3

    Wharf Mice

    Then your opinion isn't worth much to assess blame. But you do you.
     
  10. Jesse West

    Cursed by my ancestry

    Also, this implies that opinions can't be well researched and based on fact. As if an opinion reached using well founded reasoning skills has the same value as one that doesn't. It's the same reductive bull shit you see on CNN.

    This is so stupid. Holy shit.

    VICTIMS DONT GET JUSTICE IN OUR SYSTEM SO OF FUCKING COURSE I'M NOT GOING TO TRUST OUR SYSTEM.

    Notice how you ignored the actual lawyer who posted above.
     
  11. Jesse West

    Cursed by my ancestry

    And this shit you're doing? It contributes to victims not getting justice.
     
    Aaron Mook, storm and skogsraet like this.
  12. Malatesta

    i may get better but we won't ever get well Prestigious

    this comparison is beyond facile. i don't even know where to begin picking it apart because of how shoddy it is.
     
    Butinsmallsteps and Jesse West like this.
  13. emeryk3 Feb 25, 2018
    (Last edited: Feb 25, 2018)
    emeryk3

    Wharf Mice

    They can be, yes. But chances are you're not impartial in the way that a judge would be. Whether that's a fan who protests innocence for a celeb/band or it's you just assuming the accused is guilty because you don't believe in the justice system.

    I'm all for more support in these cases. But twist my words all you want, dude.
     
  14. emeryk3

    Wharf Mice

    No, it doesn't. Again, you can take these allegations seriously without automatically accusing anyone of guilt. That's where the court verdict comes in.

    All you're doing is playing the role of the judge when you're entirely incompetent to do so.
     
  15. emeryk3

    Wharf Mice

    this comment is beyond facile. i don't even know where to begin picking it apart because of how shoddy it is.

    wow, logical fallacies really are easy to repeat verbatim. great argument, buddy.
     
  16. dylan

    Most-liked person on chorus Supporter

    What kind of shit ass person uses their weekend to go on a message board to argue against a victim?
     
  17. emeryk3

    Wharf Mice

    no one's arguing against a victim.
     
  18. Malatesta

    i may get better but we won't ever get well Prestigious

    i mean if you don't like fallacies probably don't start out your argument with one dawg. "black on black crime" is a racist trashfire of statistical, socioeconomic, and historical ignorance. meanwhile, the prevalence of women who have experienced rape is corroborated by lots of data and anecdotes, legal and historical examples, the backlog of rape kits, protection of predators by institutions, beyond extensive histories of victim blaming...... your comparison was just a nonsensical nonstarter. not even to mention that the last time this band was in the news, it's cause one of their members was in trouble for being a creep. cmon.
     
  19. emeryk3

    Wharf Mice

    Chill out, Spencer.
     
  20. Malatesta

    i may get better but we won't ever get well Prestigious

    good one lol
     
    SamLevi11, Aaron Mook and emeryk3 like this.
  21. Jesse West

    Cursed by my ancestry

    Defending the system that fails victims daily is siding against victims.
     
  22. emeryk3

    Wharf Mice

    It does a better job than doing nothing. And just automatically assuming the accused is guilty CERTAINLY isn't the answer either.
     
  23. wrenleslie

    Newbie

    These accusations came out a year ago and they've continued touring and haven't even addressed it until now. The FIRST accusations against the drummer came out TWO years ago and they waited an entire year to even address that, when people started raising hell about it online. Fuck this band and their victim blaming fanbase. I'm out.
     
  24. Malatesta

    i may get better but we won't ever get well Prestigious

    ok so you see the problem of the alternative "doing nothing" means the system probably isn't really selling itself well
     
    Chris Prindle and dylan like this.
  25. Jesse West

    Cursed by my ancestry

    No, it literally is doing nothing. It's admitting the system is tragically flawed and then shrugging it off, disregarding the people fucked by it every day. That's what you spend your energy on. Not advocating for victims, not encouraging the system to change. You are literally defending the system that does not work for no other reason than that it is the system. As if it being the current system has earned it some form of reverence or respect when it consistently shows anyone paying attention that it deserves neither.

    This is the same bad faith argument that ass-hats like Ben Shapiro make. Phony intellectualism.
     
    Chris Prindle, skogsraet and storm like this.