Marvel Cinematic Universe Movie • Page 35

I want a Duckman/Howard crossover too. Who owns Duckman?

 

Marvel Taps Geneva Robertson-Dworet To Script ‘Captain Marvel’

 

Just started trying to snag all these on blu ray.

I have acquired Avengers, Avengers AoU, Ant Man, Thor, Thor: The Dark World, and GOTG so far!

It's fun buying them all but I only buy them where I can get a deal! Blu Rays are pretty expensive!

 

Apparently Nick Fury will not be in Avengers 3 or 4. This is weird considering he started the Avengers.

 

Maybe he dies before then

 

I think he'll be in Avengers 4, he just hasn't filmed his scenes yet. There is no way the person that formed the Avengers won't appear in their last film.

 

It's actually surprising his character has survived this long in a movie. He always dies in everything else

 

This is pretty cool.

 

Sebastian Stan Teases The Scale Of AVENGERS: INFINITY WAR And Suiting Up As Captain America

Fingers crossed

 

He says literally nothing about Captain America except to politely move the interview forward. Comic book film coverage continues to be tabloid-sized trash.

And, as much as I like Sebastian Stan as Bucky, he'd be such a boring Captain America. That'd be such a terrible, lame creative choice. How anyone could have any interest in anyone besides Chris Evans or Anthony Mackie in that role is beyond me.

 

That's because that Josh Wilding guy posts anything for clicks. I'm still crossing my fingers for Bucky because I would find it much more interesting for Steve's childhood friend, who became one his best enemies imo, back into his friend in order to fight by his side protect the Earth while dealing with after effects of being brainwashed. Why would you rather see Anthony in the role opposed to Sebastian?

 

All of that can be accomplished without shoving Bucky into the Captain America role, though, which isn't really the next logical step in his character arc as established by the MCU. If Steve Rogers picks up the Captain America mantle again, Bucky serving alongside him as the Winter Soldier is a good fit. If not, I think the best next step of Steve's narrative would be to become a sort of Nick Fury-esque "Commander Steve Rogers," not to die (as opposed to Tony Stark, whose best next narrative step would be losing his life in the fight against Thanos); this would still leave room for Steve and Bucky to be working together without a Bucky Barnes Captain America. In the latter scenario, Bucky's next appearance would be either Sam's partner in a "Captain America 4" or "Avengers 5" film, or Natasha's partner in a "Black Widow" film, with Steve appearing in said film as well in a brief but significant capacity.

As for why I'd rather see Anthony Mackie in the role, the racial politics of it are obviously inseparable from whatever choice they make: Putting forward a new white lead within the context of the 12 years of the MCU we'll have had after Avengers 4 without first expanding POC leads beyond Black Panther is pretty gross. If that were the only factor, though, I could also just advocate for a Rhodey Iron Man and Bucky Captain America leading Avengers 5, with Rhodey taking the top position because his character is more prepared for that. Which, honestly, I'd be down with that film.

However, looking at what we've seen so far from Bucky vs Sam, and also looking at Sebastian vs Anthony, I just think that, if "Captain America" is a mantle that assumes leadership (both of a team and of a film), then Anthony Mackie is the better fit. Bucky has the emotional journey with Steve, but emotional journey doesn't inherently imply passing a mantle. Sam's journey with Steve is a lot more akin to a strategic partnership and even almost a type of apprenticeship. Sam's been Steve's closest ally since the end of Winter Soldier. Again, if we assume that Steve isn't Captain America, at least for a time, after Avengers 4, but we also assume that, regardless of contract negotiations, Steve's narrative journey shouldn't lead to a death right now, then the most natural next step would be Steve being promoted to Nick Fury's old role and Sam being promoted to Steve's. Plus, I think Anthony Mackie has a type of charisma that could carry the type of films Marvel makes far better than Sebastian Stan could, while also having a lot of fertile, untouched territory for character arcs to carry the next wave of Captain America/Avengers films.

 

Agree with pretty much everything you said, but I just wanted to highlight this because I'd be about 140% down with this. Rhodey as Iron Man isn't even unprecedented, and I really just want more Rhodey

 

Plus, Rhodey mentoring his niece, Riri Williams (Ironheart), would be wonderful.

 

I like that you brought up that Sam is the better fit for leadership. I agree with that and is one of the reasons why I see Bucky as a better choice to take the mantle. Assuming Steve dies in Avengers 4, which is very likely, I'd argue Bucky has a closer relationship with Steve compared to Sam. Having his friend die before him, imo, would have a much heavier impact on Bucky than any other character. I see this as a very interesting turn for Bucky's character and the arc that could follow. Does Bucky have the leadership capability that Steve has? Absolutely not. Bucky is not the leader that Steve is, currently. Having Bucky take the mantle, not because of any abilities he may have to lead, but because he wants to honor his childhood friend and allow him to live on through the name of Captain America would be great. You could have Bucky struggling with it and even questioning if he has what it takes to fill the shoes of Steve, but continues on and eventually becomes the leader the Avengers need by sticking through it because it's the right thing to do and is his way of making up for Steve sort of taking the fall for Bucky's actions (with the events of Civil War and Bucky being the catalyst of the fall out of Steve of Tony). There is so much Marvel could do what story and I'm just scratching the surface.

 

Isn't Rhodey's niece an actual character in the comics that's basically the same as Riri? Can't say I know much about Iron Man or Ironheart but I think I remember some confusion about that when Riri was created.

 

Bucky as the leader of the Avengers over someone like Sam, Rhodey, Carol, or T'Challa would be just the worst. Who the heck wants the story of some unprepared white dude stumbling into that role over characters who are better set up for that right now? Outside of racist/sexist pricks who wanna see themselves in yet another white male loser, of course.

Not that stories of new leaders who feel out of their depth can't be interesting, but Sam Wilson can have that story better than Bucky can right now. That would be a natural next step for him. That would not be a natural next step for Bucky's story.

And, I can't understand why people are so stuck on Steve dying. It could happen, but it probably won't. Marvel isn't gonna kill everyone off in one big swoop, and killing Tony makes far more sense if they wanna have a big death.

Yep:
Lila Rhodes (Earth-616)

 

Rhodey at Iron Man with Bucky as Cap would be great, but I don't think Marvel is going to lose RDJ when they lose Chris. Bringing in a new Cap seems to be a higher priority (by the fans and characters arcs) than bringing in a new Iron Man.

That said, whoever holds the shield will probably only be seen in teamup films. With the numerous solo films for the new heroes that need to be focused on, I don't think Marvel will make room for solo films about Bucky Cap or Sam Cap.

 

SPIDER-MAN: HOMECOMING Tops WONDER WOMAN With $823M Worldwide; Posts Massive $70.8M Opening In China

 

I completely disagree. Fan-wise, the only reason anyone discusses Steve Rogers possibly dying is because he died in the comics in the aftermath of Civil War, but expecting that was as stupid as expecting an unmasked Spider-Man. The story the MCU told was never going to match the comics outside of general premise and some glorified Easter eggs here and there. If the fans stopped looking at trashy click bait articles and started thinking practically about where the MCU has been, currently is, and is seemingly heading, then they absolutely wouldn't think Steve Rogers is most likely to die.

Look at it this way: Robert Downey Jr is 52 years old. That's 4 years older than Hugh Jackman and an entire 16 years older than Chris Evans. He'll have 9 appearances as Tony Stark after Avengers 4, vs Chris Evans' 7 as Steve Rogers and Hugh Jackman's 9 (including one brief cameo) as Wolverine. RDJ is also more expensive to use than Chris. Plus, Marvel could easily have more RDJ after his death by getting him to voice an AI without it being weird; there's no comparable way to reintroduce a dead Steve Rogers without getting into some overly complex Cosmic Cube or Skrull nonsense, which wouldn't go over well at all with general audiences.

The only pragmatic argument I've seen for Chris Evans stepping down is that he's supposedly always talking about stepping down, but if you look at his statements, his only complaint is the grueling schedule. His seeming flip-flopping looks to me like someone wrestling between a love of the character and a desire to not be trapped by the role. If, instead of dying, Steve Rogers stepped into a Nick Fury-esque role (as he did after coming back in the Brubaker run, and again for the first couple years of the Sam Cap era), I bet Chris would be excited to remain a big part of this world while having only a tiny fraction of the commitment required.

As for character arcs, Tony Stark's death in Avengers 4 would make way more sense. On a thematic level, that film is supposed to be the culmination of Marvel's plans starting with the first Iron Man film in 2008, so it'd be deeply appropriate to end the era by putting to rest the character who started it all. Also, look at Tony's story thus far. He was functionally the villain of Age of Ultron, Civil War, and Homecoming; you could argue that applies to IM3 as well. Between those films and his backstory in the first Iron Man, he has a ton of red in his ledger that hasn't been truly addressed. He's a broken man who cannot truly say that he's done more good than ill. What better way to have him answer for his sins than for him to have a hero moment akin to his near-sacrifice in the first Avengers, minus survival?

Steve Rogers has had a very different journey thus far in these films. He's made mistakes, but he has no egregious sins to answer for. His journey has been less about recklessness and more about loyalty and what it means to do the right thing. In the first Avengers, Winter Soldier, and Civil War, Steve is realizing that the world isn't as simple as it seemed back in World War 2, but he still wants to be an inspiration in the 21st century as he was back then. (My favorite example of this is, in Winter Soldier, when he saves Natasha and she asks if he thinks she would've done the same; he simply says that she would now.) You certainly could let the culmination of this journey be an example-setting death, but that would be far less emotionally and thematically rewarding than a Tony Stark sacrifice. A better culmination would be for this man who's wrestled with authority for pure reasons to step into that authority himself and see how he can handle it.

 

Please tell me you were involved in directing these films? I would love to see this vision come to life.

 

I feel like Steve has been set up to easily pass the shield down either himself or as a request if he dies (I can even see Tony being the one to hand the shield to Bucky because of how much Steve believed in him and because it's what "he would want"). He tossed his shield down at the end of Civil War, he is becoming jaded with how everything around him is operating which affects his reasoning and symbolism of Captain America, and now there is word that the Russo Bros. are writing him as just Steve Rogers and that his Captain America alias will not be self-proclaimed. With Bucky's revival arc (side-kick to villain to anti-hero) and the close detail to Sam and Steve's relationship in both TWS and Civil War, I think it further prepares the shield being handed to one of them.

There hasn't been a second in any of the films that I've felt like Tony was letting loose of Iron Man or getting comfortable enough to hand it down to someone else. He was supposed to put it at rest at the end of Iron Man 3, but he couldn't and continued being Iron Man anyway. Tony's and Rhodey's friendship was, to me, strongest in Iron Man 2. There was only one scene between them taking place at the end of Civil War (when Rhodes is trying to walk) that showed any sort of bond between them that wasn't work related.

All my feelings could change depending on Steve's and Tony's arcs in Avengers 3 and 4, but for now I don't feel like Tony's arc has been prepared to be taken over by someone else. There is definitely potential with the stuff you mentioned above, but it hasn't been shown to be in full-effect mode like the potential in Steve's arc. The producers seem to care more about showing Steve's relationships with Bucky and Sam lately than with Tony and Rhodey.

 

Well since Cap seems to be the topic of discussion lately, I suppose my new podcast episode on The Winter Soldier is fairly timely hah. Welcome to Geekdom Episode 048: Captain America: The Winter Soldier

 

I've gotta disagree. I'm not going to make someone's race or gender give them the edge over what role they should take. If Sam's and Bucky's relationship with Steve was switched then I would be in favor for Sam taking the mantle 100%. I do not care if the next CA is black, white, Hispanic, Asian, male, female, etc. I just think the most emotional and logical way is for Bucky to step up. I do enjoy hearing what your view is, though.

 

I would hate Bucky as CA because I don't really like Bucky. He has zero charisma.