Julien Baker - Turn Out The Lights (October 27, 2017) Album • Page 77

Look I’m not getting into this again for the millionth time on this site. There’s a huge difference between supporting a close friend as they seek treatment/rehabilitation/reparations (which nobody even knows if Cam is actually doing btw), and using your public platform to praise that person in any way. That’s all. The space to acknowledge Cam for his contributions (which came before the allegations against him were made known) is in the liner notes.

 

Again, Julien actually is an acquaintance of Cam’s so she has the ability to talk to him whenever she chooses and I’m sure she knows more than we do.

 

I don’t know the backstory on this, but I am always happy to hear when good people are helping those with problems, and not people who are bad influences or indifferent people.

Whether or not people carry on making music or not, they exist in the real world and will need support, even if at times they don’t deserve it.

Julien strikes me as someone very self aware beyond her years, and seems very well liked and respected across the music industry by her peers.

We are often outsiders on the real happenings, and I know even less that all of you in this. Just hope things work out as best as they can under whatever set of circumstances for all involved.

I kinda just came to see if her record store release was was streaming.

 

I’m imagining somebody making this argument about someone who is still publicly friends with JJR and how that would be received on this site

 

The liner notes that didn’t come with the 7”, you mean? Also, these two songs aren’t new. They were done during the TOTL sessions in 2017. Cameron’s accusation didn’t come out until 2018.

Also, appreciate the mansplaining. Very much appreciated.

 

I understand the sentiment of this post, but just because someone is directing frustration/disappointment towards Julien for this, that doesn’t mean they aren’t also angry about the predator. I don’t think these things are mutually exclusive (in fact, I’m sure if someone is unhappy with Julien in this situation it’s because they are even more angry at Cam).

 

The JJR and Cam situations are quite different. JJR publicly accused people who believed the victim while trying to end their careers and actively defended the abuser. Julien isn’t defending Cam here and of course believes the victim. She has seen more than we have and knows more about how Cam has handled the situation than we do, so we have NO room to be talking here. End of story.

 

You don’t get to make a post riddled with speculation, dismiss how people feel, and then proclaim the conversation over. Sorry.

 

Let me know if anyone finds a link to the song.

 

How is it speculation when Julien was friends with Cam and they hung out together? We know they were friends and in contact with each other, so it makes total sense to assume she knows more about the situation than we do.

 

You’ve even said it in this post: assume. That is speculation.

 

If you are friends with someone, and that person does something wrong, as their friend you are going to know more about the situation than someone who is not their friend whatsoever. Would you not agree?

 

But you are not friends with Julien. You are not friends with Cam. What you are doing is speculating based on what you think might be the case.

 

the speculation is you saying that because julien is friends with cam that she knows something we don't, and that something is somewhere in the realm of cam's innocence. which, yeesh. all anthony did was say he was disappointed that an artist he likes used their platform to credit a rapist when they didn't have to.

 

He was a part of the song, the song was recorded before the allegations came out, and this is the ONLY time she has publicly mentioned him since they came out. She's mentioning him in a place of officialness, not because she wants to defend him.

 

But she doesn’t have to thank him. She chose to thank him.

 

This also says nothing of how often the friends of predators or really shitty people don’t know/see the shitty behavior when it happens. They’re often good at hiding that from people they don’t want to see it.

 

lol fuck off. this is such a bad faith conversation right now it's ridiculous. no one is saying julien wants to defend cam. no one is saying julien is problematic. no one is calling for julien to be canceled or anything like that. People are expressing their disappointment that she'd choose to use her platform to publicly thank a r*pist. She isn't legally compelled to @ him on instagram and there are plenty of ways to thank him privately. it's that simple. we all love julien and her music and can recognize her "woke"-ness and her work in the industry, both musically and her work of providing safe spaces, speaking out against abuse and harassment, promoting women and having inclusive tour line ups, etc etc etc, and at the same time criticize her for posting to credit cam.

 

Very good point. Thank you.

I’m going to step back from this. Agree loving an artist and critiquing them is important and not mutually exclusive. Didn’t think about a private thank you, but it definitely would’ve been better.

Appreciate the civil discourse. Always here to learn and grow.

 

I’m guessing no one here is inside the dynamics of her relationship’s with these other people (I could be wrong so I so correct me). So it’s kind of, “if it were me”, or “I do or don’t think”?

Julien seems to have had a lot happen with the people around her though last year, with Scott, Cam, Phoebe, and maybe others I have no idea about. She writes about a lot of personal struggles, and I hope she just stays true to herself, and I’m guessing she tries her best to approach each situation according to the best way she knows how (like most people).

 

Links to songs:

Red Door: Dropbox - 01 Red Door.mp3 - Simplify your life

Conversation Piece: Dropbox - 02 Conversation Piece.mp3 - Simplify your life

 

Vinyl rip?

 

Yes. Not mine but found via subreddit. If not allowed, feel free to delete.

 

I've still never found Distant Solar System.

 

Do you mean a physical copy?