Half Waif - Lavender (April 27, 2018) Album • Page 3

You guys need to stop being upset when people have strong feelings about not listening to an act when it comes to abuse.

 

i dont know there is a "you guys", this is like the first post ive made about any abuse related situations outside of stuff ive said in the accountability thread. i havnt been posting on chorus nearly as much as i used to for the passed couple months. i havnt been involved in anything.

also, i genuinely dont think my post had an upset tone.

 

And Casey, i really do hope you respond to my post. Because im not "upset when people have strong feelings about not listening to an act when it comes to abuse" at all. - again i have not been getting involved. and i dont deserve a drive by "you guys" post when i have not participated in these types of conversations before.
You made this post in this thread:

and i think this is a good, productive post that makes sense concerning an important topic related to accountability. Its a tough situation that i think merits some discussion among users (the dynamic between abusers and their peers that also happen to be close friends).

the reason i made a response to the post in question here is because i dont think writing Nandi off as one to make disgusting remarks, or having a "screw Nandi" attitude helps anyone come to any sort of conclusion on what is and isnt okay in these types of situations.

 

I just think that if someone truly feels “screw Nandi” it’s really not for anyone to try to convince them otherwise. Especially by pulling the “I bet there are abusive artists you still listen to!” card

 

But I didn’t make an I bet there are abusive artists you listen to post. I made a post referencing the fact that the victim themselves did not intend or desire for this situation to become public, so why should Nandi reference it in an interview where she wasn’t asked her opinions on it. That’s all I’m saying. I’m not trying to say at all that people can’t ceel a certain way.

Again, I think these are hard conversations that are good having. I’m not trying to play hush. Someone gave their thoughts, and I gave mine - that Nandi probably deserves a break. Anyone is entitled to disagreeing with that, and I’m willing to discuss it here or via PM or whatever

 

you aren’t the only person posting in this thread. I’m speaking in general, taking bits and pieces of both posts

I don’t think Nandi deserves or needs any defense, for any reason.

 

I am the one that pulled that. And I’m standing by it. I think there are productive ways to have conversations about this stuff. And i don’t think coming into a thread and simply saying “screw this artist” is a good way of having that conversation.

 

would you rather people call out nobody then? do you think that anyone who listens to any abusive artiste does not have the right to call anyone out?

 

People can call out all they want. But there are better ways of doing it than “screw this artist” especially in this specific case. People have a right to do whatever they want though. I just think acting like this is all black and white is stupid, and acting like anyone who listens to this artist is somehow less than you is stupid. Not saying you are doing this btw.

I also think people are imperfect and make mistakes. I think there needs to be room for growth and change and simply saying “this artist can screw off” makes that kind of thing impossible. People are going to make mistakes, say dumb/problematic things etc and those people also need the chance to change/become better

 

gotta be honest, think in this scenario it's at best condescending and at worst outright demeaning to think that Nandi isn't solid enough in her beliefs and opinions to weigh in on something she inarguably knows more about than us. I'm not about to participate in tearing down a powerful female artist based on something she said off the cuff in an interview re: a situation that wasn't supposed to be public record to begin with

 

I don’t think she should be torn down, but I think people should respect those who have powerful emotions regarding feeling let down by nandi

 

I’m glad you have things so figured out @cwhit

 

Respect should go both ways then

 

Sure, people have the right and responsibility to be critical and I'm not going to make a broad assertion on how people should respond to her remark

That being said, I think it's important to acknowledge Nandi as a person of character. Regardless of how I feel about the issue in question I find it really belittling to act like we know something that she doesn't and assume she's endorsing abusive behaviour instead of admitting she's a human being with relational tethers that may influence an off the record remark. Especially given the nuances of this particular situation, I think when we start to undermine female opinions we are losing the fucking plot

She is at worst complacent but she knows more than we do and I think trying to make insinuations about her character based on extremely little evidence is a dangerous precedent

 

Well I supported her up until a point and I'm still massively disappointed about her comments re: Pinegrove. I was excited to listen to this album until a few weeks ago. Fucking sue me I guess.

 

that's fine? I'm not saying people should stop being critical, but unless you're closer to Evan than Nandi is I think forcing this narrative around the release of a brilliant record is damaging an important female voice

 

I don’t see that at all though? I think the voices criticizing her are definitely fine. It’s not her support of Evan that bothers me, it’s her saying “I’d always support someone like him”. The only reason I haven’t been more angry about this is that I think it’s fucked that she got pursued that way by the interviewer. But I truly do feel that word choice is dangerous

 

again. would you rather me just never draw attention to any abusive artist? Or someone who stands by abuse? I’m not perfect, I’m always learning, but I will never not jump in in these situations

 

Nandi is not an abusive artist.

She gave a statement that doesn’t condone anything that Evan has done. She said that she will likely work with him in the future. I assume she knows Evan much better than you and I do and knows what he is doing in terms of rehabilitation. Not everything is as black and white as you’d like it to be.

 

Isn't it equally dangerous to misquote? She didn't say someone like him, she said him specifically. You said it's not her support of Evan that bothers you but it's her support of Evan that bothers you? The word choice is dangerous, but when she was not equipped or had no time to form a more thoughtful response like one may assume she'd have done in a rehearsed situation, I think a negative assessment of her character is kind of shameful given the disparity of knowledge between artist in question and discerning listener

Also @cwhit is asking important questions and while I may differ in this instance we still need to recognize and have this dialogue, and I am in no way trying to take away from people offering criticisms

 

I would say in general for this situation I haven’t criticized or questioned anyone supporting her. But I truly think it’s wrong to tell someone who doesn’t support her that they are misguided.

She’s gotten a ton of press on this album, it hasn’t hurt her. But she does deserve criticism regardless of how people think of her

 

I feel like if she wasn’t satisfied with her response to the interviewer afterwards then hopefully she would’ve said something to try to clarify her position, on a platform where she had full control over her words and could take all the time she wanted to explain herself. If she didn’t do that, I think it’s fair game to take her words at face value and assume that she said what she meant to say, and in that case this sort of criticism is totally warranted. Sure, it may have been not-great journalism on the interviewer’s part (which is itself something that could be further debated), but I don’t see why Nandi or anyone else should get free pass on a response like that just because of possibly questionable interview tactics, when enough time has passed for her to clarify her response if she felt she needed to.

 

It’s just weird to treat her as if she abused someone when all she did was say she supports her friend. People make mistakes, people do bad things. People need to have a chance at fixing things and becoming better. If she thinks Evan can be better, then there is nothing wrong with her supporting him.

 

There are some things that are irreversible but I think it's crucial to realize people's ability to grow and change and be better. If I was only my mistakes, I wouldn't be where I am now. I think that we all need to retain our empathy while we rightfully criticize problematic shit.
Not everything is black and white

 

I always love it when two artists I like support one another!