HAIM Fire Their Booking Agent • Page 5

Maybe the one time I can think of the industry being slightly unfavorable to males could actually be Paramore. None of those dudes were signed to Atlantic and were seemingly pushed around for it. I blame the industry and the powers that be for that shit.

 

I think the authenticity issue only really comes up at the start of an act's career. Male or female, if said act continues delivering quality those people constantly claiming they're an "industry plant" tend to disappear. Paramore has delivered 4 great records (and 1 pretty good one with their debut) so for those who are still following, I doubt anyone really gives a shit these days.

 

Agreed, likely a case of young people without much knowledge of how contracts/business deals work being taken advantage of. I remember Paramore also signed one of those Live Nation 360 deals back in 2007-08 but not sure if they're still beholden to it.

 

But don't forget that it's (at least in part) because they've been heavily marketed as a "female-fronted band", something that doesn't exist with men.

 

I think you can argue that men are always the status quo with bands. So it's a novelty to see a woman be up front and center. That's how lopsided the musical landscape was and still is for women.

I think the big difference between a band like Paramore and a band like No Doubt is that No Doubt was an actual working band that got signed. Paramore was a in a weird infancy period and the label didn't want "them". So they signed HW and she convinced the label to build a band around her with her actual band or whatever. This obviously created problems internally.

It's like Avril Lavigne. She had a "band" made of dudes, but they probably weren't organically playing together. So when they left (I assume they did) nobody cared. Paramore had a pretense of them being a real rock band through and through, when that wasn't exactly the case.

How similar is that to Boys Like Girls? I heard that band was mainly centered on one dude and hired guns.

 

I guess I just don't get why ten years on we're still saying Paramore isn't a "real band" because of decisions that shitty adults made that the literal children in the band had to make the best of. They practiced together as children, they wrote songs together, and then they ended up being a band with Hayley. A label stepped in and mucked it up, and they did their best with what they were given. How is that not real?

 

Pretty sure BLG was put together the same way Paramore was.

 

I don't see anyone labeling them to be NOT a "real" band. If anything, I think the rotating lineups would add to the confusion, not the initial contract signed back in 2003-04.

 

I think the other bandmates coming out saying how slighted they felt about it is what added the most to it all. They at least felt they had been lying about it and weren't totally honest with their fans. But anyway, it's not a big problem if you're a fan of the band and the music. The narrative that the band put out just was not accurate. Also I think a lot of bands resent it because they "paid their dues" and seemingly weren't created by outside forces if you will.

 

You really don't know what you're talking about. You have a bunch of half-truths you've somehow turned into full blown bonkers shit ('pretended'). Incubator labels are as old as time, there's nothing "nefarious" about it. Virtually every band that ends up signing with a major label has been on one. It allows a smaller group to work on a band without devoting huge resources to them right away without knowing if it's worth the investment or not. Labels from DTR, to FBR, to Epitaph, to The Militia Group, have all helped work a band before they were ready for a major label. These incubators or farm-league labels are good things, not bad.

 

Except: Fall Out Boy's work with FBR and a major label is barely different than Paramore's.

 

Huh? I know this and never said otherwise? The only part I disagreed with in that post is that FOB went with Island/Def Jam and Paramore went with Atlantic. I think over time FBR became fully integrated with Atlantic, but I don't know if that's 100% accurate. My point was that FBR bands weren't automatically assumed to be on Atlantic. Maybe they are now, but they weren't back in the day. It's like DTR and what was it, Geffen?

 

We are like so off-topic and that's probably my fault, but can you confirm for me whether or not people knew before Josh's angry blog about Paramore's label situation? Because I SWEAR I knew about the Atlantic thing the entire time, but I'm wondering if it was teenage me re-writing some memories to be like "ah yes of course I knew this why is it even drama!"

 

Yes they were. That entire deal with John and Atlantic was set up when Paramore and all those bands signed with them.

 

But in 2003 was that so? I think the label had a huge change around then. So is FOB on Atlantic?

 

Never said it was. Sonically, they've been mining similar territories the entire time.

 

Paramore signed in like 2005.

No, FOB signed with Island Records.

FBR and Atlantic then entered into an upstream alliance, and were distributed via Warner Music Group's ADA. That investment lead to Atlantic taking on FBR as a full subsidiary later.

 

WTF are you talking about, you said in the post I quoted it was different.

It was not. Fall Out Boy's deal with Island was barely different than Atlantic and Paramore with FBR being the incubator/upstream label.

 

So I do know what I'm talking about.

 

My post was in response to someone asking why people never slung the "industry plant" term at Fall Out Boy compared to Paramore. I noted that Fall Out Boy came together from various bands in Chicago and even released an EP which was pretty scrappy. Because of these events, I believe that's why they've never been accused of being an industry plant. Don't see how there was any confusion there.

 

I mean, hell, it said "ATLANTIC RECORDS" on the back of the albums ...



... I know basically anyone that followed AP.net knew what incubator and upstream deals were. Cartel, The Matches, a bunch of bands that never panned out, all had them. I thought it was common knowledge what FBR was for these bands and the options major labels had for first refusal or to bring them up.

 

No, you don't.

 

Because you're wrong. They've been accused of that from day one because they signed with Island Records and their debut was upstreamed via FBR. Just like Paramore.

 

(Shrug) I guess I just can't keep track of all the complaining that went on back in the mid-00's. I don't remember that being a common sling made at FOB but could have just not been looking in the right places.

 

I love that people have flat out forgotten all the controversies that mattered so much to everyone in 2005.

OMG "sell outs" and "manufactured bands" ... and now, we rightly, don't give a fuck.