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Frank Turner - Be More Kind (May 4, 2018) Album • Page 27

Discussion in 'Music Forum' started by okayibelieveyou, Jan 28, 2018.

  1. Danny

    Regular Supporter

    Koji reached out to Frank re: the Mongol Horde name being inappropriate and Frank is reacting in about the worst way possible, not a good look.



     
  2. Sean Murphy

    Trusted Supporter

    frank has never, ever, ever been good with handling criticism via twitter replies. he always comes off like an ass.

    that said, i'm unfamiliar with the context or interpretation of the term "mongol", is it an offensive/derogatory term?
     
  3. Jake W

    Golf Story > RDR2 Supporter

    Koji > Frank anyday
     
    Carrow likes this.
  4. Danny

    Regular Supporter

    I'm not super educated on the subject either but here's a response:



    I just wish he would listen instead of immediately dismissing it as someone 'outrage fishing' like come on, Frank.
     
    Joe4th and Jake W like this.
  5. Jake W

    Golf Story > RDR2 Supporter

    Nervus is the best band
     
  6. MexicanGuitars

    Chorus’ Expert on OTIP Track #8 Supporter

    If anyone had thought Frank had his finger on the political pulse may I direct you to the worst song of his career and 2018
     
    Jake W, Sean Murphy and Danny like this.
  7. Danny

    Regular Supporter

     
    Jake W and Carrow like this.
  8. Carrow

    Japanese Bonus Track

    oh of course he's being a prick about this. of course.
     
  9. Sean Murphy

    Trusted Supporter

    looks like a lot of his tweets about this are gone now
     
  10. Carrow

    Japanese Bonus Track

    if you must have shit takes at least have the spine to stand by them and not delete them while blocking people who call you out on it, Francis.
     
  11. MexicanGuitars

    Chorus’ Expert on OTIP Track #8 Supporter

     
    sonder and Jake W like this.
  12. Sean Murphy

    Trusted Supporter

    lol his reactions to this completely contradict the entire message of the album he's out supporting.


    come on now frank.
     
    sonder likes this.
  13. Carrow

    Japanese Bonus Track



    get in the bin, Francis
     
  14. Snoblin

    Chaotic-Good Goblin Person Supporter

    Damnit Frank. Koji’s 100% right. Just change the fucking band name.

    the bit about Koji trying to “bolster their profile” is pretty absurd
     
    Joe4th likes this.
  15. Carrow

    Japanese Bonus Track

    jesus christ that's so fucking snobbish, imagine just shitting on someone with much less of a profile than you for like, no reason? fuck this guy
     
  16. Donnie Ruth

    Trusted Supporter

    Ugh. I love Frank and in all my interactions with him he has shown great respect for his fans, however, he is AWFUL at responding to criticism on Twitter.

    I think he feels EVERYONE on Twitter is out to get you. However, this person contacted him via email and explained it. Frank didn’t want to listen and this person, rightfully, shared it and opened the door. To then handle yourself like that on social media and in the public is dumb.

    You write an album called Be More Kind then get called out for support of a band with a racial name (even if there were no negative connotations behind it), and you lash out? Not a good look. Listen to others and be more kind to others, isn’t that the message?
     
    Mary V, sonder, Joe4th and 3 others like this.
  17. stars143

    Trusted

    Is the problem just the name?... not too familiar with them, but the first song on their album is all about Genghis Kahn and the Golden Horde. Does that song bother people too? Also - I'm surprised this hasn't come up before. The band has been around for 7 years.
     
  18. Snoblin

    Chaotic-Good Goblin Person Supporter

    I think mostly it’s because the band is just a side project with one release. It’s hard to give a shit about something when you don’t know it exists.
     
    stars143 likes this.
  19. Brother Beck

    Trusted Supporter

    It's hard not to feel like he is utterly full of shit when his responses fly completely in the face of all the messaging behind his latest album and the tour and his whole brand really as of late...

    I know he is historically bad at handling things online, but I don't see why he wouldn't ask himself what is more important, the honestly pretty silly name of a side-project from a long time ago with one release that was most likely picked on a whim anyway, or literally everything that you have been working towards lately?

    I've read up a little bit on it, and I can't say I understand completely why it is offensive yet, but I am not the person who is offended. He should just go with "The Horde", or better yet, use it as a teaching moment and call themselves something like "If you're attending this show you probably know what we used to be called but we are all trying to be better people so don't call us that anymore."
     
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  20. Carrow

    Japanese Bonus Track

    A solution involves changing literally three letters: calling themselves Mongrel Horde would have been a better name to begin with, no better time than now. He's utterly fucked it, mind. Completely full of shit.
     
  21. Brother Beck

    Trusted Supporter

    That's a great one!!! I originally was thinking 'Mongolian Horde' but I don't think that one would be any better and would be just as offensive to the same people.

    He's definitely made himself look like a HUGE asshole right now, but I think if he came out right now and said: "Wow. I really acted like a complete asshole and did none of the things I have been singing about and encouraging everyone to do as of late, and I am sorry for that. I would like to change the name to 'Mongrel Horde' going forward and again I apologize to anyone I offended with the name of my band back in the day or with my assholery in the past few days."
     
    Carrow likes this.
  22. stars143

    Trusted

    'Mongrel' is a pejorative for those of mixed races (or breeds - usually the word is used in the context of animals). Seems like a much worse name, IMO.
     
  23. Donnie Ruth

    Trusted Supporter

    I never realized the discrimating meaning behind that word, but I am very open to learning and growing from it. Glad Koji did this.

    It really, really looks poor on Frank. Even if you did not know the issue with his side projects name, just change the derogatory word to one we as a society are much more educated on and the situation plays the same:

    Person who is touring a new album with message about being more kind and making racists ashamed again has a band name: “The N-word Horde.” (Please forgive me for using this example, meant to showcase how bad this situation really is.)

    Someone via email asks them to politely understand the racial discriminating issues with name.

    Person says “I thought it sounded cool; came from a song. I’m sorry you feel this way.”

    Someone brings it to public attention, asking for a real discussion to end this kind of discrimination in music.

    Person lashes out, blocks everyone, refuses to have chat.

    Person plays show tonight and gives nightly speech on being kinder to others, while trying to make money off this message of being kind to others and respecting everyone.
     
  24. Sean Murphy

    Trusted Supporter

    it's just validation that we can never stop improving ourselves. never assume you know it all, there is always room to educate and learn and better yourself in effort to make a better place around you. this was a real easy thing for frank to be a better person about. definitely a bummer to see this reaction and subsequent weaseling out.
     
    Donnie Ruth likes this.
  25. stars143

    Trusted

    Is this true? "Mongol" has multiple meanings in English, one of which is a pejorative based on John Langdon Down's racist use of language for those with Down Syndrome. It's my understanding that Down Syndrome used to be called "mongoloid syndrome" until decades ago when the Mongolian government requested otherwise, for obvious reasons.

    Summing up my thoughts - obviously calling someone a "mong" or "mongoloid" is very offensive. However, the band is just referring to a historical empire (or khanate, to be precise). It doesn't seem to touch on other meanings of the word. It seems like a name in the same vein as "We Came As Romans."

    I'm not Asian and may be missing some context and the connotation of the word "Mongol." If I am way off on this I would love to educate myself and learn more.
     
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