Dragon Ball/Z/Super TV Show • Page 60

Namek saga will always be the most iconic IMO, but Android/Cell is probably the peak of the show.

Something I loved about those sagas that Super hadn’t really been able to replicate is how tense it was even being in proximity of the enemies. Like the heroes had to straight up hide from Vegeta and Frieza because getting close to them basically meant getting fried immediately. It was anxiety-inducing.

Though that probably has to do with the fact that DBZ was big on repeatedly keeping Goku out of the picture until the end so most of the sagas were carried by the weaker characters.

 

Once you notice that trend it becomes maddening. There will be 3 or more different reasons he is separated from the group in every saga.

 

His various ins and outs during the Buu saga are definitely frustrating. The 24 hour / "use your energy wisely" thing with Baba lasts for like 40 episodes, the whole time you know he's going to be gone at some point but Toriyama just keeps dragging it out lol. Part of me re-watching as an adult kept thinking "man, we're still not even to the part where Goku is taken out of the mix"

 

One Piece has this exact formula turned to 11 with Luffy, particularly in the beginning of the show where he starts off the series like Goku in DB: capable of easily beating up 99% of the people he comes across. But it makes up for it by creating convoluted comical reasons why he can’t be present for the main fight right away, usually due to his own idiocy.

Whereas with DBZ there’s never really any excuse for it beyond Goku either taking time to travel long distances or needing time to recover. Nothing inventive about it

 

Cell Saga is the worst. First he is knocked out by the heart virus, then he is either waiting or in the Hyperbolic Time Chamber, then he doesn't come back to help against Cell after the explosion. Other than his half-fight with Android 19 we never get to see him fight any of the other androids or the first two forms of Cell.

 

It is funny that Goku never even met 17 at all in DBZ.

 

IMO, the future of Dragon Ball would have been more interesting if Goku remained in the afterlife and Gohan/Vegeta shared roles. Vegeta could have sacrificed himself at the end of the Buu saga or early in Super. Super would then involve Gohan/Piccolo leading the groups with Goten/Trunks eventually taking over.

Goku has never been anything more than [insert new power level here] guy after the Cell saga and it’s one of my main complaints with Super.

Daima has been great due to its tone, but it would have worked with Gohan and/or Goten in Goku’s role.

 

I love that Goku was out for so much of the Cell saga. It adds a level of tension when for so long their best chance against the Androids or Cell is Vegeta, a person that no one can trust or reason with who is constantly berating and threatening the good guys

 

I honestly think the most frustrating instance was Dende not healing Goku after they fought with Ginyu. He was the only one who knew about his own healing abilities but he just leaves Goku to sit in the tank while they all get whopped by Frieza lol.

It's wild how Z's formula was to keep Goku out of the battle for as long as possible and he also never fought alongside Vegeta even once (outside of the Meta Cooler movie).... Yet that's all that Super is - Goku and Vegeta vs. Everyone.

 

The DBS manga is finally back!

Weird how we were just discussing the Otherworld Tournament saga and now Olibu was made somewhat canon in this arc by having his statue up at the museum, name and all. And also a nod to Mutaito, Roshi's old master, in there too.

 

I liked this chapter. The Goten/Trunks super hero stuff is a nice calming area of the story. Nice bridge to whatever arc is coming up next.

 

You think this arc will bridge into whatever the next arc is? Hadn't really thought about it, but it just seemed like another prequel to Super Hero to me.

 

I just meant a bridge from when the manga ended last year to whatever arc starts this year in release here. Not a bridge narratively

 

Got ya. I just wondered because I didn't expect them to come back with a prequel and sort of backtrack narratively after a layoff. I love these little low-stakes slice of life sort of chapters though.

 

I wouldn’t mind if the next arc starts off with Goten and Trunks on another adventure stopping crime. I imagine it wouldn’t be a big time jump from the end of chapter 103.

 

I was reading a theory that they think Goten and Trunks will get some sort of level up to be on par with Beast, UI, UE, and such and it could mean some massive war is coming. I’ve only read a portion of DBZ manga and will likely go through it all soon. So I don’t really know if that makes sense or not.

 

I wish they would. I enjoyed Goten and Trunks being in the center of the action in the Buu saga. Since then they haven’t done anything except in the manga super hero arc.

Which makes me wonder - is the manga version of super the canon version since Toriyama was more hands on with it than the anime?

 

I’m pretty sure anything Toriyama worked on would be the canon version.

 

I believe the general consensus is that manga is always canon

 

That’s how I’ve always viewed it as well