Doughboys Podcast Podcast • Page 223

Anyway, the question of paying podcast guests is secondary, this conversation started with this ridiculous assertion, which is ridiculous:

No one has a right to tell a business they should pay their employees?????? Businesses should be forced to pay their employees!!! And I'm allowed to express opposition to business practices any way I want, including things other than just not giving them money.

How does anyone disagree with this

 

Is shrimp tails the new hot salad?

 

While the the question definitely needs to be discussed, and the industry as a whole needs to shift more towards the Doughboys model, the answer is way more nuanced than you're making it out to be.

 

In terms of the nuts and bolts of specific agreements, sure. Otherwise, I don't know what this means.

 

I spoke a little out of turn. Yes, you have the right to criticize a business' practices. They also have the right to run their business how they deem fit. If they don't pay their employees, people aren't likely to work for them, unless they find something else about the job beneficial. Should it be illegal to not pay your employees? Probably, but some people might find guesting on a podcast to be mutually beneficial aside from just physical revenue.

 

How many new podcasts have you listened to specifically because of the guest that was on it? Have you then subscribed to that new show because of enjoying that particular episode? I’m assuming the answer to both questions has been yes at least once, it’s happened to me multiple times.

Guests are often the draw for shows, even when they’re not rich. To not pay them is exploitative when they are often the reason you are making money. Sometimes the guests are well-off and don’t need the money, but that’s not always the case.

Years ago when you’d see Gabrus pop up on CBB as Geno, or see Gemberling on an i4h, or when Lapkus was getting brought back on to those shows a lot, or Adomian was doing Ventura, you knew they were must-listen episodes. But they were struggling improv/stand-up comedians working for free for a million-dollar podcast company. That’s exploitative.

Like Ben said, exposure doesn’t pay rent. I work in this industry, and exposure is bullshit. It’s the first word that will make any reasonable person turn away from a job now, and it’s better for everyone to not play into it.

At the end of the day you’re doing valuable work for someone who has the ability but refuses to pay you because, well, think about what this can do for your career! It cheapens labor and normalizes the expectation that someone new and green should work for free because that’s just how it goes, and that’s how he/she over there started, and oh look they have a Netflix show or a Patreon now. But it doesn’t end that way for most.

And Lapkus, for example, isn’t successful just because she was lucky enough that Aukerman was so gracious to let her on CBB a bunch. She’s successful because she worked extremely hard on stage and on camera and on mic and is talented. If Earwolf and these other large media corporations want to exploit that talent for profit and not give some of it back, that’s their prerogative, and if a comedian is willing to work for free, then whatever. But they’re working for free because the policy of not paying them gives them no other choice. It doesn’t have to be that way, and it doesn’t have to be excused.

 

This pretty much boils down both sides of the argument. I agree that the current "let's not pay them" model is a bad way to do things, but I also feel like it's the prerogative of the employer/employee.

 

Sure, but that doesn’t make it easier to digest

 

Seemed like you were putting your union argument forward as a blanket solution, which wouldn't work for a lot of scenarios. My bad if I misinterpreted that. My point was it needs to happen, but the solution is complicated and not one size fits all.

 

Does Headgum pay or just DB's?

 

I suppose, but I don't why see a union can't negotiate at least a basic framework as a guideline. Obviously not all podcasts would be able to pay according to that but I don't think the podcast format is so massively different that the SAG model is an impossible dream

 

The unfortunate thing about Earwolf is that paying the guests a modest amount should have a negligible effect on their bottom line. The Boys pay $100, but even if they only paid $50 an appearance, it's certainly better than nothing.

 

I was gonna make a post about how the margins on non-Stitcher Premium shows was probably so low that paying all guests/hosts would severely impact Earwolf’s bottom line, but after looking up the rates, I don’t think that’s true.

The standard cost for podcast ads currently ranges from $18-25 per 1000 listeners, depending on length of the ad and placement within the episode (and Midroll’s website says the price can go up to $50 per 1000 listeners depending on the podcast). It’s hard to estimate for sure since Earwolf’s numbers are kept secret but a user on the Earwolf subreddit used to track approximate listener totals based on Soundcloud plays. Here’s his/her findings for average listeners in 2016:

Earwolf Listener Numbers (bootleg): 2016 Totals : Earwolf

So take a mid-range Earwolf show like HH. According to these numbers, HH was averaging just under 40k listeners per episode. So at the cheapest possible ad rate, it would cost $720 PER AD to advertise on HH. If the average HH episode has 3 ads, Earwolf makes $2160 off that episode. Seems like enough to slip the guests $100 or something for their time. And that’s a mid-range show, something like CBB or HDTGM gets up towards 300,000k listeners per month.

I’m playing armchair accountant over here, so maybe I messed something up or misinterpreted something, but based on these numbers it seems insane to me that Earwolf doesn’t pay their guests.

 

You also have to factor in how much Earwolf pays in the office lease every month, cost of equipment, decorative wall shoes, etc.

 

Yeah, but they could easily make all that with just one episode of HDTGM. Unless Chef Kevin really got the best of them with his salary negotiation.

 

Maybe spend a little less on a new T-shirt for every CBB line that gets a laugh so that you can spend a little more on your talent idk

 

Is this a t-shirt?

 

Bonobos, get us some fuckin' t-shirts!

 

Bono should just buy earwolf tbh

 

If you (a poscast host) are making money off the work of someone the else (the guest) then it’s fucking absurd to think that money shouldn’t be shared.

I like Scott but I sure as fuck wouldn’t listen to CBB if it was just him alone with a microphone.

 

Nearly did a spit take when Wiger revealed he was on a televised spelling bee. Because of course.

And now I need to know his take on PTA movies. Full podcast run. Let’s go.

 

Glad they both agreed Magnolia is great

 

Armin’s dad was Tom Cruise’s lawyer and one night he came over to his house when he was in high school and was impressed with his Magnolia poster in his bedroom

 

Loved the ep