Doctor Strange In The Multiverse of Madness (Sam Raimi, May 6, 2022) Movie • Page 30

Yeah. As awesome as it is to see Raimi go full force with Wanda in instant kill mode, I would have liked to see a more character driven Strange/Mordo film.

 

Her Wikipedia says she just turned 16 in April. That doesn’t seem right though because she would have been 14/15 when she filmed this and she doesn’t look that young.

 

Also, this has been percolating in my head all day and I’m not sure I have a point or just some random observations.

I was talking to somebody on twitter about Wanda and how I was bummed she died because she wouldn’t get a chance for a redemption arc. There are multiple moments of judgment in the movie. The Illuminati judges 838 Strange to death, not for creating an incursion, but for the threat he could potentially be. You could argue the Darkhold had corrupted him too much, but I’d argue that he was able to see the wrong in his actions and went to the his friends that he was not too far gone. Did he fuck up? For sure. But did not come across as a guaranteed villain. Yet they kill him.

the Strange that was originally with America judges the life of America insignificant in the grand calculus of the multiverse. The demon stopped him. Her fate remains open to whatever life has for her.

the Illuminati begin to judge our Strange before being interrupted by Wanda. The way that was going it probably wasn’t going to go in our Strange’s favor as in general the Illuminati seems to be pro punishment before crime. But 838 Charles does channel the Fox Charles by explaining that not all who stumble are lost, revealing that he likely regrets what they did to 838 Stephen and decides to give our Strange the opportunity to live on and do good that they hadn’t given 838 Strange.

At the end our Strange is forced to judge America against the grand calculus of the multiverse again and if her life is worthy to take or not. Of course he decides that her life is worth it and gives her a chance to do what’s she’s meant to do in the way only she can. Then America has to judge Wanda of figuring out her weakness since her strength was not enough to stop her. Only she could take Wanda to where she wanted to go and could see the monster she had become.

If Charles hadn’t basically allowed our Strange to escape he would have never been able to be there to save America. And America would never have had the chance to stop Wanda.

so, yea, I’m bummed that Wanda saw herself as irredeemable and felt she had to choose death (seemingly, it’s Marvel, you never truly know unless you see the body. Even then…). Could she not have destroyed all the darkholds and stayed alive? Her life was filled with constant death and trauma and tragedy. Her last real happy moments were with people that she created. They weren’t even real happy moments. It just such a tragedy.

I don’t say all this to imply there should not be consequences for our actions. But there’s gotta be a better solution than death. So permanent and unforgiving. We find out in the mid credits that our Strange made an incursion happen. But rather than be judged for it, Clea pops out and recruits him to fix it. Who knows how you do that, but if it’s possible, it makes the Illuminati killing 838 Strange all the more sad.

I just wanted that chance for Wanda. The movie makes it seem like she went directly from Westview to going full blown evil and disregarding the lesson the show seemed to tell us. The show took the time to take an entire episode detailing all the pain and trauma she had been through to remind us that she was only human and that she was born with her powers. She hadn’t asked for them. So even after showing what drove her to make Westview, she finds out that she is causing pain to these people and learns that she fucked up. So she gives it all up. Nobody else could have stopped her. She beats Agatha, who was her only real threat. She could have recreated the hex and continue on. But she was given a chance to choose and she chose wisely. The show even goes out it’s way to have Monica tell her that nobody would understand the sacrifice she had made. Which, was a little weird. But that’s the message the show was conveying. She seems to go off into isolation to process what just happened and was a good place to stop for now. But then they did show her using the Darkhold and we hear the kids voices. But at the time we didn’t truly know what the Darkhold would do to her. Her studying it doesn’t play as evil. She wanted the kids back, that desire makes sense. But this movie she is full blown evil now and has no regard for human life. She does try to be reasonable, but nothing could come between her and her desire for these children that are not hers. She’s so evil that she has to die. Sigh.

random thought, you’re telling me that in the infinite possibilities of the multiverse there wasn’t one where Wanda had died after giving birth to the boys? That she couldn’t have been dropped in there and adopted them? Maybe even with Vision? Something similar to what happens to Natasha at the end of What If. She was able to fill a hole that someone else had left. Would have been pretty beautiful of America could have done this for her. Not fixing anything, but giving an opportunity to get to know the other universe and help bring healing not just to her but to those boys and anyone else who had been close to Wanda. Where her baggage could be a burden and a hard learned lesson but unknown to her new universe allowing her a chance to heal and grow from it and to do good there. Could have been nice.

I don’t know, maybe I just see too much of myself in Wanda. I’ve had more than my fair share of death and trauma in my youth than some people do in their lifetime. There are people who have it far worse than i do, but I am not your average person. I’ve fucked up a lot. Haven’t killed anybody or mind controlled a whole town though. But mistakes have been made that hurt others and myself. I want to believe I can learn and grow from my mistakes and not stay stuck in this loop of self hatred and desire of self destruction. I guess I wanted that for Wanda, too.

fuck, this went off the rails cause I haven’t even gotten to the real point I wanted to get to. Along with all those judgments in the film, Moon Knight was also full of this idea of whether judging someone for potential future actions is just or only the ones who have done wrong should be punished. It’s really the central conflict of the show between Khonshu and Ammit.

I thought it was interesting that idea was present in both. Even No Way Home has Peter struggle with how to judge people and how you react to serious wrongs. Obviously this isn’t some new concept and I’m sure we could find more examples from earlier in the MCU. Like Cap seeing Bucky as his friend first no matter what he has done or what’s he’s become. He got to go on and fight Thanos and team up with Sam and is able to heal and grow to be the guy he was before becoming the Winter Soldier.

like I said at the top, I don’t know if I really have some big point. Just what’s been running through my head all day and wanted to write it down and kind of put it all into words.

god bless anyone who read this whole thing.

TLDR: the MCU is filled with moments where a person is given a chance to do what’s right, heal, grow, and do good no matter what their past is. I wish Wanda had gotten that chance in this movie.

 

Oh shit I looked at IMDB and it says the same. I just decided to do my own math and add 2. Oops. But wow, yea, she does not look 14-15. She did a great job with what she was given to do.

 

truly interminable film even by mcu standards. i hesitate to say this but the super raimi parts didn’t work at all. i feel bad for elizabeth olsen.

 

not the right reed richards AT ALL. what is that performance lol

 

I mean, I don’t really remember anything he said except when he said his wife was still alive. And that’s really just because of Wanda’s response.

 

I thought Krasinski as Reed was fine

 

I just liked that he confirmed the existence of Valeria and Franklin which hopefully means they are thinking about including them in the solo movie

 

So when Reed mentioned Fantastic 4 Strange said something about how he should be in the 60s. Is the implication that FF is going to take place then and that FF was in the 60s in 616?

 

it's the attitude. it felt more like Krasinski being Krasinski than having richards' ID at all

 

the more i think about this the more I dislike it. olsen and raimi did the best they could with miserable material. let Cumberbatch be done. fucking eternals was better than this mess.

 

I think you have me blocked if I recall correctly.

but no, he made a joke to the effect that a name like that would have been a band that topped the charts in the 60’s.

 

oz the great and powerful was better

 

I liked this thing a lot.

Not exactly the strongest plot or whatever, and anyone calling it more Sam Raimi than Marvel Studios is being hyperbolic. But, my gosh, it felt so good to have some Marvel/Disney characters I love adapted into a movie that was... fun. As in, "fun" to my current tastes, which Marvel Studios has mostly exhausted outside of Taika Waititi & James Gunn. It didn't have the quaint simplicity of the Venoms or the levels of batshit that Malignant reached, but it scratched at some of the same itch for me those do.

While mentioning other movies it made me think of, thank goodness I almost never stumbled into comparing this to the flawless movie of the year, Everything Everywhere All At Once. If I'd done more than passingly think, "hey, Wanda is doing discount Joy," it would've been unflattering. Apparently I have room in my heart for two different spring 2022 multiverse films, one brilliant and the other dumb superhero fun. (Glad I can wait 'til next summer for Across the Spider-Verse, though, tbh!)

Best characters were Wanda, America, Charles, and Bruce Campbell's pizza balls guy. Final post credits scene ruled.

 

Only pop my theater gave was for the 90s X-men theme.

When will movie Charles learn to leave these powerful mutant women alone. It never works out for him.

So does this mean that in all these universes that Westview stayed a thing and Wanda still had everyone enslaved?

 

Do you ask that because the kids existed in the other universes? If so, I don’t think their existence is tied to pulling a Westview.

 

Well since we know things are pretty similar across universes, they’d have to be created in each one right? Or at least most of them. Maybe it didn’t take a whole town being held hostage to do it though.

 

I mean there differences. I don’t recall any indication that this version of the kids were artificially created. Unless they tell us otherwise, I’m operating under the assumption that in the other universes they were born naturally.

 

There's a universe where everything is made of paint. I don't think they have to have been created in most of them.

 

The hype did not deliver on this. Raimi did a great job visually, but the dialogue was (again) painful. Is it really that hard for Marvel to hire some writers who don’t feel the need to throw in the constant quips?

 

I guess I just figured that they made it a point to show Strange’s injuries are very similar but slightly different and the whole sister dying thing that most of the details were the same just slightly off.

I thought the first round of credits with the character portraits were funny. Like they included the Dr from the wedding in the very beginning.

 

Film is ight. Not sure how often I’ll return to it. Maybe it will be a good Halloween rewatch. First Strange is better, imo.

I loved the horror stuff in this and the Shuma scene, but everything else just was eh. Looking forward to more Chavez & Wong, though.

Phase 4:

Shang-Chi
No Way Home
MOM/Black Widow
Eternals

 

man i hope stuhlbarg got a check and a nice lunch in atlanta out of this