DC Cinematic Universe Movie • Page 32

Sounds sort of in line with the theory of Flashpoint soft-rebooting the DCEU. Still curious to see if The Batman is going to be connected, technically connected but standalone, or disconnected entirely.

 

The Batman will be a good way to just start over, no need for a flashpoint. If people didn't show up for JL, why would people for flashpoint?

 

Because Snyder's not involved.

 

hmmmm. I don't know if that much of the movie audience chose to not go see JL because of Synder, let alone knows or cares who the director was. Only time will tell though.

 

*checks Wonder Woman box office results*

Yeah, it's because Snyder makes shitty movies and everyone knows it now.

Make a good Flash movie, people will go.

 

Really want just a solid, fairly small Flash movie. I still can't believe Johns is okay with them doing Flashpoint so early.

 

WW had being the first big female superhero movie behind it to though, but if the first Justice League movie failing at the box office doesn't really support my case, I don't think anything will, so like I said "we'll see".

 

No, it had it being a good movie behind it.

 

I guess we can @ each other now

It was a really good movie, I liked it a lot. We can't dismiss the importance of it being the first female lead superhero movie though and the support that brought and would have brought even if it wasn't was well received.

Didn't everyone also really like Justice League? I only heard good things about it from most people.

 

You only heard good things about JL? Seriously?

 

Yeah for the most part. The census seemed to be "a mess but expected, a lot of fun and I want to see another and where they go from here". Leaps and bounds better than what I heard and still hear about SS and BvS.

 

The average movie goer probably couldn't tell you who Snyder, but that doesn't mean their reasons for not going don't go back to Snyder.

 

I heard that a lot, too... but a lot of people just tore it apart. The reviews Destroyed it. There was a lot of negative stuff said about it.

 

In the end, I have no idea what's going to do good anymore. I cannot explain living in a world where SS makes more than JL.

Fair point.

 

I mean, I enjoyed it for what it was. But there were a lot of problems.

 

Same here, just sad it got destroyed in reviews you said.

 

I think it's funny to think Justice League is the end of the DCEU. Man of Steel still led to BvS, and they didn't even have a Wonder Woman to lean on back then. Just make a good movie that hits that sweet spot between familiar and new, and then market it well. Rethinking strategy is smart, but rebuilding the universe after Justice League (for all its flaws) set the table for some decent spinoffs is silly and unwise.

 

Yea, but money talks and JL did poorly.

 

And Wonder Woman didn't. Who's gonna reboot that franchise, and if that's gonna continue, why reboot everything else? The lesson that Wonder Woman (and, in a way, Logan) should teach us is that you don't have to reboot after a film that didn't work in order to bring audiences in for a film that does, as long as you make a quality film. They've got plenty of time to do that with their various projects in development right now.

 

Agreed. I'm just putting myself in the mind set of a Hollywood exec whose job is just to make the most money possible. Having your films big team up movie not even make as much domisicly yet as just the opening weekend of Avengers has got to be crazy to them. Think of all the money this should have made.

 

If they use Flashpoint to reboot they can still keep Wonder Woman.

Keep her, dumb the garbage, and move forward.

 

I suppose it's not a ton different than Xmen DOFP situation sorta.....

 

That'd just be unnecessary convoluted nonsense. There's nothing Flashpoint would reset that couldn't be accomplished in future spinoffs and sequels without rebooting anything.

Just look at Fox's Marvel films. One could be tempted to learn the opposite, wrong lesson from Fox by viewing DOFP as a template for Flashpoint, but that film succeeded because it told a solid, cohesive, emotionally effective narrative, not because of anything it did or didn't do with continuity. The sequel, Apocalypse, took advantage of that film's continuity tweaks, and yet due to the film being a hot mess, it had an underwhelming performance. On the flip side, Logan treated The Last Stand, Origins, The Wolverine, and the first X-Men film as canon, and yet it was a critical and financial success. (I'm also tempted to use the example of Thor: Ragnarok, but while The Dark World wasn't exactly a hit, that did still have the Avengers films to work with.)

You could also just look at DC itself for a solid example. Batman v Superman was a critical failure and, after an initial strong opening weekend from the hype of finally seeing these characters together, bad word of mouth had the film finish south of expectations (though still not terribly). However, without rebooting anything, Wonder Woman was able to be a big success: It made around $80 million more domestically (though $30 million less worldwide, but that's off a $60 million smaller opening weekend) with a $100 million smaller budget, and it was a major critical hit.

All that to say, if you make a good film, general audiences aren't going to say no, just because they didn't like some other film some of those characters were in. Just put together one strong film that doesn't feel like a direct sequel to Justice League, preferably something that hits that sweet spot between familiar and unique, market it well, and let the positive word of mouth start shifting the narrative. Aquaman has a decent chance of being that film. After that, make another one. And so on.

Just out of curiosity, since you said it. On a narrative level, what "garbage" do you see that needs dumped that would require a Flashpoint-esque in universe reboot? Regardless of the quality of Justice League itself, what character was left in a place that only Flashpoint could fix?

 

Why are you under the impression that I think they need to use Flashpoint for all of that? I simply think it would be an easy in story way of changing literally anything they want to. It’s one option. That’s all.

 

I've always said using Flashpoint is probably the best way to handle a restructure.