Coheed and Cambria - Vaxis - Act I: The Unheavenly Creatures (October 5, 2018) Album • Page 69

That's what's always made me roll my eyes at prog rock fans though, is the "yeah, this isn't really prog rock. now *this* is prog rock!" mentality. and yeah, TMV is way "proggier" than Coheed has ever been, but like you said, that side of the spectrum has way too much self indulgent wankery.

Honestly I can explain/define genres fairly well, but I always have a hard time with prog rock. At what point does it have just a little bit of experimentation and your just a creative rock band?

 

I mean, Coheed is a great example. There’s a big difference in their style between GA1 and, say, the Afterman albums or the new album. I consider Coheed, at this point, to be an alt rock band, but they’re a very creative alt rock band and push the envelope of what that sound can be. They have some prog rock flourishes in their style from time to time, but they’ve become much more straightforward in their sound over time.

I used The Mars Volta as an example not to be like “This is real prog rock!” but to show what the difference is between a band that goes all in on their prog rock sound and a band that dips their toes in the pool from time to time but has settled on big hooks and more conventional song structures with flourishes of flashy instrumentation and songwriting like Coheed at this point.

 

Honestly at this point, I consider Coheed "alt rock" until a song goes over six minutes. Then I just call it a prog track lol.

 

That’s a little disingenuous for obvious reasons, but I’m gonna chalk that take up to you jesting

 

I feel like they mainly get lumped into the prog category now mostly because of the whole concept album thing.

 

As a prog rock guy, there's always been a bit of an "I know it when I hear it" thing about the genre. I think the overall best way to place it, although it obviously doesn't work all the time, is a general willingness to eschew the verse/chorus structure, and drawing of inspiration outside of the rock genre.

 

Prog rock and prog metal has always been unique to me in that it's the only genre I'll actually get kind of bored at how "progressive" it can be. I guess maybe going hand in hand with self-indulgence, but so many prog rock and prog metal bands will go for all this stuff that I'm just like "yea I can kind of just go to any other prog rock and prog metal band and hear similar takes"

Coheed almost sets themselves apart to me in a way by going for a more structured, alt rock formula. Because to me, adding twists and unique flairs on what we know is a formula that works rather than go flat out for being progressive in a genre that has countless bands all going for that already is more interesting and has more potential for more memorable songs

 

I really wish I enjoyed this record more than I did :/

 

This has been productive, thanks. I guess I really like rock bands that have progressive tendencies moreso than straight up prog rock. Is that what Thank You Scientist are? they bore me to tears. But I love Opeth, so.

 

I’m not familiar with either of those bands, but I think Circa Survive is another one of those bands that writes alt rock music with very atmospheric and prog tendencies. They’ve brought a lot of that prog nature back with their last two albums after pushing it to the side with Blue Sky Noise and Violent Waves.

I am in the same boat though. I had a fairly narrow idea of what prog rock was when I was younger and always thought I was huge into it, but as I’ve listened to more prog rock, and to a lesser extent prog metal, bands I’ve come to realize I enjoy that type of music in small doses or in carefully chosen ways within alt rock or whatever than just straight up prog rock/metal. There are only a few prog bands that I actually enjoy.

 

Thank You Scientist are what I would consider a "prog" band in the more traditional sense and I don't really like them at all. Songs are way too long, take too many detours, not catchy enough, parts seem to be written for no reason other than they're difficult and impressive to play

they are very good live though!

 

I’ve always felt like prog music, like straight up prog, has always been musicians’ music and even that feels weird to say. I’m a musician and I find most prog music I’ve checked out to be a chore to get through

 

Yeah I can definitely see that Circa falls into this kind of in between post-hardcore/alt-rock/prog-rock genre. Thank You Scientist were picked up by Coheed's record label, and they seem to write music that appeals to people that... like Coheed, and that's about it. I'm very surprised you're not familiar with Opeth. I'd say they are *the* defining band of progressive metal in the 2000-2010 range. They went straight prog rock on their last 4 albums though, which most would tell you has been a mixed bag as far as quality.

 

This is 100% true, Coheed fans generally speaking have the absolute worst taste of any band I listen to. Will fucking stare and blink at like 99% of the extremely sick opening bands they bring out and whine out loud that it should be Thank You Scientist instead

 

Yeah, while I claim Coheed as my favorite band, I like to think I'm not a "Coheed fan". I was at a festival they were headlining a couple years back, and some fans got to the front, like 6 hours before they were scheduled to play, and were clearly having an awful time while watching...
*checks notes*
Basement, Cave In, Desaparecidos, and Thrice.

 

Honestly the last time I saw Coheed they had Thank You Scientist open and they were far more entertaining.

Still don't really care for them otherwise

 

Prog is a rough genre because it's actually very difficult to write a good song outside of the traditional song structure! Most of my all-time favorite bands are prog bands, or at least have progressive tendencies, but there are so, so many prog bands that I think are just awful.

 

This whole discussion basically explains why I like Math-core/rock and rock over prog-rock

I always believed that when a band pushes forward for a more traditional progressive structure, it removes a lot of honest emotion that comes through in the songwriting

 

I cannot, for the life of me, get into math rock music beyond early Minus The Bear

 

I'm guessing you don't like the start-stop dynamics?

 

I couldn't name a math rock band if I tried. Is it djent or are we talking something else?

 

Math rock falls under stuff like Tera Melos, TTNG, And So I Watch You from Afar etc.

One example that I think of is Protest the Hero, and comparing their Kezia/Fortress stuff compared to Volition and etc. They became technically more progressive but I just can't for the life of me get into the newer stuff

 

I think “start-stop dynamics” is not exclusive to math rock. I just haven’t found any math rock band that has stuck with me. I mentioned Minus The Bear, but I rarely listen to them anymore and they pretty much stopped writing math rock music after two or three albums.

 

Yeah that's a great example. I called PTH a favorite of mine even after Scurrilous, but the stuff since has just been okay. You could tell when they lost their original drummer some of their originality and energy left with him.

 

I’m not familiar with PTH pretty much at all, but didn’t they only release one EP after Volition?