Apple Company • Page 614

Epic’s battle for “open platforms” ignores consoles’ massive closed market

Most if not all of the complaints Epic makes against Apple and Google seem to apply to Microsoft, Sony, and Nintendo in the console space as well. All three console makers also take a 30-percent cut of all microtransaction sales on their platforms, for example.

This DLC fee represents a big chunk of those console makers’ revenues, too. “Add-on content” was a full 41 percent of Sony’s Game and Network revenue in the latest completed fiscal quarter. Microsoft saw a 39-percent increase in gaming revenue the quarter after Fortnite was released, too, coyly attributing the bump to “third-party title strength.” And the Switch saw similar post-Fortnite digital revenue increases after Nintendo announced that fully half of all Switch owners had downloaded Fortnite.

On mobile platforms, Epic is calling the same kind of 30-percent fee “exorbitant” and says it wants to offer a more direct payment solution so it can “pass along the savings to players.” On consoles, though, Epic happily introduced a permanent 20-percent discount on all microtransaction purchases, despite there being no sign that the console makers have changed their fee structure.

Interesting argument.

 

Ben Thompson also did a pretty good write up on it all over at Stratechery.

I've been enjoying his and John Gruber's back and forth about it on their podcast Dithering, but this is a good breakdown of it all too.

 

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

(And yeah, maybe 30% should be lower, but Epic had to know this was an option.)

 

Wow, preventing them from even developing is a bit much. But at the same time, you have to expect retaliation for violating terms and conditions. This shouldn't come as a surprise to them

 

idk I am in theory on Epic's side in this, you shouldn't need the App Store to get stuff onto an iPhone, but I fully acknowledge Apple's right to do as it damn well pleases with their devices.

That said the way Epic is doing it is fucking wild lol (also I genuinely don't think they have a *legal* case)

 

Maybe I'm looking at it wrong, but I do not see the problem with apple requiring their app store in order to get apps on the phone. It seems to be beneficial for security, use/feel consistency, and convenience. If they were open like Android, it would be chaotic and hell and you'd have so many people who would have shitty apps and complain about the experience, their phones being even slower than usual, bad apps, stolen information, etc.

 

Apple isn't doing anything wrong per se. Sure 30% is high I guess but no one is forcing you to sign that contract and adhere to those terms.

 

I mean, no one is forcing me to sign up with Comcast as my internet provider, either, but that means I would have no internet since they have a monopoly where I live

That's the dilemma app developers face

 

I think they should keep the app store but allow third party payment systems that have to use Apple's API, maybe even require Sign in with Apple, to keep payment details/personal details secure and safe. A better backend, like Stripe's, would be beneficial for everyone and if Apple had to compete, against, say Stripe, it would make their system better as well.

 

They have other stores and platforms to use

This isn’t rural America where you only have one IP choice

 

Facebook also took a bit of a dig at apple. https://eu.usatoday.com/story/tech/2020/08/14/facebook-apple-app-store-fees-fortnite-ban/5584896002/

Tactically, should Fortnite have done this nearer the launch of the new phone?

 

Oh fuck right off Facebook.

 

They don't have any other stores to choose from on Apple, and one could argue that not going with Apple when there are only two platforms could set a developer up for failure. It's still an Oligopoly when it comes down to it when only given two options. Though it is nice that Android allows installation from other stores

I get what you mean though and I don't even necessarily consider myself right or that I have the answer, it's just an interesting conundrum to me. I do think a charge makes sense, but yeah the 30% is a bit steep

 

right I feel you - like I said could the cut of 30% be lower? absolutely. there is definitely a discussion to have about it. but the way epic went about it was short sighted and you won't find me crying for that company haha

 

Oh yeah absolutely agree on all that

 

but see that's the thing, iPhones don't really have that big of a marketshare, so effectively you're only locking yourself out of, what, 15% of the market if you forgo iPhones? Like, I get that's where the money is, but it's not *technically* a monopoly.

 

what's the defense for apple blocking game streaming apps from the app store (e.g. stadia, xcloud)? i'm sure those services wouldn't be happy about apple taking a cut, but they'd probably live with it to reach the millions of users. my understanding is that they're flat out not allowed to operate on ios.

 

Oh yeah, technically speaking, I think you're right. There's a lot of difficult gray area to navigate here. It'd be interesting to see comparisons in app/subscription purchases on Android vs Apple. Android may take up a higher marketshare, but you also have to factor in how fragmented Android is and that you have to have a phone with good enough specs to run some of those apps and games.

It's a weird situation for sure

 

How about games just don’t have micro-transactions? I know, I know, wishful thinking but damn games suck now with all the extra buying.

 

The base game is free. Fortnite is incredible value if you stick to the season pass. It essentially pays for itself and then some.

 

Yeah, that's full on shitty, and Apple's explanation is trash, especially when you have all you can eat apps like, Netflix, HBO Max, even Marvel Unlimited and so forth. That one I don't much care for myself.

 

This is a bit tangential but I know this and similar threads have justified apple’s 30% take on the grounds that they’re providing devs with a large, secure market for their products. while true, I Think I generally stand on the other side of the chicken v egg dichotomy here. While the iPhone offers a lot in value besides just apps, the apps are why I (and many/most) bought it. Smartphones offered a blank phone slate where you could effectively add whatever features you wanted. Without developers creating must-have or unpredictably cool apps, the iPhone doesn’t become what it is today. I mean, think of how many of the base apps are just bad or useless, they know devs have at least one hand on the iPhone wheel.

 

Beats 1 is now Apple Music 1 with a bunch of new shows and hosts (including one with Mark Hoppus)

 

Apple announces Apple Music radio