Alien: Covenant (Ridley Scott, May 19th 2017) Movie • Page 18

Discussion in 'Entertainment Forum' started by airik625, Jun 21, 2016.

  1. Dinosaurs Dish

    there was neither a light nor a heat in his words

    Yeah, I totally agree actually. I don't think the extra stuff outside the movie is bad by any means, but if it's necessary to enjoy a movie, then the movie failed for me. Like, I still loved Prometheus without that video, but yeah, I get what you're saying.
     
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  2. Your Milkshake

    Trusted Prestigious

    The script illicited the same response in me. I cant not throw my hands up in the air at it. I think alot of it is just stupidness, plain and simple. Which is an utter shame because the big ideas are fun on paper. Also being trapped in the blockbuster horror genre does it no favors, you get some tropes taking precedence over those big ideas.

    Also the script being nonsense wasnt suprising to me with Lindelof being involved (Im not trying to be a dick but I really dont think hes worth anything).
     
  3. Your Milkshake

    Trusted Prestigious

    if this were a series with a better script and time to develop the big ideas, that retcons the films (or is parallel canon)

    that would be cool
     
  4. angel paste

    grey hairs, get out of me zoots! Prestigious

    prometheus is such a beautiful mess i love it
     
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  5. Dog with a Blog

    Prestigious Prestigious

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  6. Dinosaurs Dish

    there was neither a light nor a heat in his words

    Those kids must be so thrilled that it's getting so much positive attention. What a fun time for them.
     
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  7. Brother Beck

    Trusted Supporter

    I know, that really is so cool. I can remember daydreaming about putting on productions of stuff like that back when I was in school.
     
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  8. Dinosaurs Dish

    there was neither a light nor a heat in his words

    I'm gonna have to start performing a one-man version of Prometheus one some corner in downtown; hopefully Ridley will notice me.
     
  9. Dog with a Blog

    Prestigious Prestigious

    *runs into traffic*
     
  10. Brother Beck

    Trusted Supporter

    I finally watched these videos. Most of the questions they bring up for Prometheus were not things that bothered me or questions that I had. Interestingly, these videos made me like Prometheus slightly more, but they made me like Covenant a whole lot less.

    I used to honestly agree with the people who say Damon Lindelof is a terrible writer and he should not be allowed within 100 yards of a script ever again. I will say that I no longer believe that is true HOWEVER, Damon Lindelof writing and Ridley Scott directing a movie that plays with mystery like this was an absolute trainwreck. A match made in hell. I don't think they could have picked a worse writer for this project to come in and rewrite Spaihts' script at Scott's bidding than Damon Lindelof.

    Look at how many times in that Prometheus video they reference Fox's marketing materials. All of that information is stuff that Lindelof and Scott were privy to and had in their heads, but I think they lost sight of how much of that information was getting across to the audience. I know that they did not want to explain every little thing and that some mystery was intended, but for me they did not get enough of the story successfully across to the audience in a satisfying way.
     
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  11. Your Milkshake

    Trusted Prestigious

    ha so what made you change your mind on Lindelof then
     
  12. Brother Beck

    Trusted Supporter

    The Leftovers. I haven't seen the entire series, but I have seen a lot of it, and it is fantastic.
     
  13. Dinosaurs Dish

    there was neither a light nor a heat in his words

    Ok cool, I’m glad you checked out the videos and appreciate your patience with me combatting every point or question you had, haha!
     
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  14. Brother Beck

    Trusted Supporter

    Are you kidding, I love this! All of this has made me appreciate parts of Prometheus more, but it also makes it that much more crushing that the film simply does not work for me.

    I honestly think Prometheus’ fatal flaw was leaning into the mystery angle in the first place. One of the most powerful and wealthy men in human history being afraid to die and so funding an insanely expensive project that is based on a not widely accepted theory, and him being totally ruthless in pursuit of his mission and not caring who he sacrifices including the entire crew and his own daughter – THAT is a pretty cool story. Tell that story. All of the mystery bullshit – stuff like pretending Weyland is dead to have him surprise show up late in the movie in terrible makeup – actively got in the way of the audience connecting with the characters. Too much of the story had to be sacrificed to maintain the mysteries. Cutting Janek’s backstory only made it that much more jarring when he decides to sacrifice himself and the two co-pilots so quickly and easily go along with it. Yeah, they are literally trying to save all of humanity, but a lot of the audience are confused AF by this point or actively checked out, plus you gutted the stuff about Janek’s character that planted the seeds where you see this action is actually in character for him. I kinda think he doesn’t even have a character really in the final cut short of just English guy doing American accent who flies the ship.

    Lindelof was brought in to do rewrites on someone else's script, but ultimately Ridley Scott was the main driving creative force behind the project. Lindelof was brought in to write what Scott wanted and what Scott told him to write. I think Scott is an enormously talented visual director, and a very financially successful producer as well, but I do think he is also someone who has shown a stunning lack of insight into even what makes some of his own movies work. Look at all of the stuff with him being obsessed with Deckard being a replicant in Blade Runner. Both one of the original screenwriters and the actor who played him have said that he simply was not a replicant when they were making the movie, but that they appreciate it being something that was left open-ended where you could watch it and maybe think that. Ridley Scott is the one who somewhere after the fact decided that Deckard is absolutely definitely 100% a replicant. Even if he thought that at the time - and I am not saying it is beyond belief that a director, a screenwriter and an actor could have different takes on the material and yet the final product still work - he was either smart enough at that time to recognize that not answering it definitively made the movie better, or he was simply not powerful enough at the time to strong-arm everyone else on the production and get his way. Ridley Scott did not have the same clout in 1981 that he came to have later on in his career.
     
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  15. Dinosaurs Dish

    there was neither a light nor a heat in his words

    Well, I love mystery and ambience which helped me love the movie pretty much right away. It makes sense because I loved Lost and The Leftovers and Twin Peaks.
     
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  16. Brother Beck

    Trusted Supporter

    I don't hate mystery in and of itself, I just think it is very hard to do well and can easily end up frustrating and alienating your audience if not done right.

    I haven't watched new Twin Peaks yet, but I love original Twin Peaks. Lost I do not like. At all.
     
  17. Dog with a Blog

    Prestigious Prestigious

    I love Lost and Twin Peaks is like my favorite thing in the world but I still hate Covenant
     
  18. Dog with a Blog

    Prestigious Prestigious

    Bruh. You need to see season 3 of Twin Peaks. I loved the original run already but season 3 might be the best thing I’ve seen on tv
     
  19. Brother Beck

    Trusted Supporter

    Alien: Covenant was far from perfect, but I simply cannot hate something in which Michael Fassbender says "I'll do the fingering" to Michael Fassbender, and then later proceeds to kiss Michael Fassbender.
     
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  20. Dinosaurs Dish

    there was neither a light nor a heat in his words

    The characters of David and Walter and the excellent portrayal of them by Fassbender is far and away my favorite thing of these two movies and with a lesser actor, I might not have been nearly as infatuated with these films.

    And I’ll second the Twin Peaks: The Return love. It’s bizarre and lovely and terrifying.
     
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  21. Brother Beck

    Trusted Supporter

    I had started re-watching Twin Peaks because it had honestly been a long time since I had watched it around the time of Season 3 coming out but I never got through it or around to watching Season 3 just because life. I am going to have to find the time.
     
  22. Dinosaurs Dish

    there was neither a light nor a heat in his words

    Be sure to watch season 1 then 2 then Fire Walk With Me and then the new season in that order.
     
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  23. Brother Beck

    Trusted Supporter

    Will do.
     
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  24. Looks like Ridley Scott is working on his next Alien film after Merlin.
     
  25. Dinosaurs Dish

    there was neither a light nor a heat in his words

    Hell yeah, I'm all in.