Discussion in 'Entertainment Forum' started by airik625, Jun 21, 2016.
One third of Rocky IV are montages and I am 100% on board and here for it every time.
Even just the idea and visual of the dream helmet from Prometheus kicks fuckin' ass, holy shit:
Anyone who has an hour they want to kill, I recommend watching these two videos in order.
First, I don't agree with every single answer he provides, but they clear up pretty much every question I've seen about both movies or how "stupid" they are or how some things don't make sense. They do make sense if you dig deeper into either multiple viewings and/or reading more about the films outside of the films themselves. Although I don't think it's necessary to do either to fully enjoy the movies because I pretty much love them at this point before watching these.
Second, the condescending attitude the guy has in the video is extremely annoying and had me rolling my eyes but nevertheless the information is extremely detailed and interesting!
And I don't think they're perfect movies by any means, but I think they're both solid sci-fi movies, Prometheus being the clear better movie which I think will be looked back on as one of the greats.
What is a good reason for changing the original design of mutated Fifield from something xenomorph-esque into something that just looks like a generic zombie...???
The deleted / original version of that scene is so much better and makes infinitely more sense.
I haven’t seen the deleted scene, but in this movie and all the others, the black goo and/or different alien organisms manisfeats themselves in multiple different ways depending how they’re ingested, impregnated, breathed in through the air, etc... So to me, he and Halloway are examples of showing people in the process of being taken over and morphing into some other kind of alien infested creature. We only see Fifield before being infested and presumably hours(?) after when he’s already transformed a lot, but we get to see the slow degradation of Holloway before it fully takes over. Even he knows it’s only going to get worse and willingly sacrifices himself to save the crew.
Halloway ingested a minuscule drop in a glass of alcohol but Fifield got a full face full of acid and other “poison” pouring onto his face and presumably directly into his brain, nervous system, etc...
And Covenant takes that idea further showing that David experiments and makes multiple different variations of alien creations by tweaking how they’re developed and grow and whatnot.
I like the idea of David wanting to create life and experimenting. I don't like that he created the Xenomorph face hugger egg though. I wish he would have created the Queen alien instead, which would lay the eggs, ect. I think it would have made more sense.
This is the alternate version of the Fifield mutant attack from the deleted scenes. I think it is better in every single way --->
I’d have to rewatch Covenant in full again, but does the film actually show or say that he created the egg? The xenomorphs existed prior to David, so the queen or something similar was already a thing before he starting experimenting.
I have a pretty good memory but I haven't seen it since theaters. I remember thinking that during the movie so it leads me to believe he did create all the eggs he had in the basement, but who knows. I need to re watch it again for sure to find out.
That opens up a whole new set of problems though. Is the Alien Queen is just on the loose on that planet? This is a movie that I really liked but falls apart if you think about it for too long haha
I watched that and then the scene they put in the movie and that comes down to personal preference I guess. Neither of them blow me away really, so I don’t lean one way or the other to be honest. They’re both fine.
I’d have to watch it again but the xenomorphs existed before they even landed on the planet in Prometheus. They’re depicted in paintings and sculptures inside the engineers’ ship. They go over that in those videos, but they are mutation of that black goo combined with an engineer, like at the end of Prometheus. Maybe the queen is the product of the goo and a female engineer? I don’t think it’s spelled out 100% either way and that’s something that I find more fascinating than frustrating.
In case I am wrong, I'm not going to investigate and just go with what you wrote. I like that a lot more
Hahaha alrighty then! I’m hope I’m right! Or at least, if it’s not explicitly stated it’s somethung else, that’s what’s so great about art is that you can interpret and process things differently than the artist intended.
I had no idea about that deleted scene from Prometheus wow
"Rocky II, plus Rocky V, equals Rocky VII! Adrian's Revenge!"
I hope people here get that reference....
The random zombie-looking design they ultimately went with makes absolutely no sense to me. Why would he *not* look kinda like a xenomorph...??? I think the fact that they shot both versions and chose the one that makes no sense is very representative of a lot of the issues I have with this movie. The idea for going with the zombie-looking design apparently was to distance Prometheus from the rest of the Alien movies a little bit, which is just dumb at point, especially as a little while later a legit Alien shows up at the end anyway. I think distancing yourself from the Alien movies would have been a great idea before the film went into production, or even better while the script was still being written, but choosing to do so in one random scene 2/3 of the way through the movie is just confusing and reinforces how this movie couldn't decide what it wanted to be and what story it wanted to tell.
And just as a scene I think the alternate version is much creepier - in that it is creepy at all and not just silly and dumb looking - and it just plays much better.
Sure, I can understand all of that. I'd say the majority of the movie distances itself away from the Alien in general, but can see how people would prefer that other version.
I know I've already said it, but the idea that a bunch of people would sign up for a mission like that having no idea what it entails is too much for me to swallow. You and others writing it off as ‘well space travel is so mundane by then’ is doing the filmmakers jobs for them and making excuses for laziness and bad storytelling.
I drive my car all the time. I've spent years of my life driving a truck, a limo and a car for my job. If someone said to me “hey, I want you to drive to California and do something for me when you get there”, my first question would be “what do you want me to do when I get there?”. If they didn't tell me and just offered me a million dollars I would only be more suspicious and worried about what it was they wanted me to do, as tempting as all of that money may be. The movie does not do anything to set up or sell the idea that these people would be desperate enough to sign up for a complete mystery of a mission that will take years of their life and could very easily end up with their life ending. Just because something is mundane does not mean you just do it without asking any questions. At least I don't. If my coworker or boss tells me to go outside and walk down the street to a certain building and go inside I would ask them 'why? what am I going to be doing there?’
Part of the problem to me is relying too heavily on reveals, playing too coy with information and silly mysteries as opposed to just telling the story in a better way. You are already dealing with subjects like what happens after we die and humans going to meet their creators - deep philosophical mysteries that we can't possibly ever have the answers, the kinds of questions that have been driving humanity for millennia - you didn't need to pretend Guy Pearce in shitty makeup was dead to surprise us with Guy Pearce in shitty makeup at the end of the movie for like 5 minutes of anti-climactic screentime when having him be a part of the story all along would have helped the film make more sense, would have shed more light on a lot of the other characters motivations and actions and would have made for a better and more enjoyable story.
Those two videos I posted last night cover both of those subjects if you want more detailed answers.
As far as the people not knowing the detail of the job, all of them are employees of the Weyland company so I don't think it's much of a leap to think they probably do multiple jobs where they see an amount of money and a "time expected" or something like that and just sign up, regardless of what kind of job it is. Or they flat out lied to them in the beginning, which is probably even more likely.
Weyland faked his own death to be frozen as to not cause suspicion around this secret mission. I missed it on my viewings but apparently there's conversations and implications that they wanted him out of the company due to age and caring more about his own interests of immortality and wanted him off the board, so that makes sense to me as well.
Even then, these are again just minor plot points that don't have much to do with the overall point of the movie, so I'm able to accept them and/or not really be bothered by them.
The funny thing is, I usually despise when people just sit there and pick apart every little illogical thing or plot-hole in a movie, but Prometheus just brings it out in me. I think it is because I desperately wanted it to be great and for me it just flat out does not work as a film. If I am just not buying what is happening on screen my mind has nothing else to do but over-analyze every little thing that is happening.
I am going to try to watch that first vid you linked to on YouTube because this is a fun conversation, even though I don't usually like those types of videos. If the movie is two hours long and it takes a 30-minute video after the fact to explain why it makes sense and works then I feel like the movie didn't, you know?
I will say that I do believe Ridley Scott filmed a version of that script ( /those scripts ) that both makes logical sense and works pretty good to great as a movie, but I just do not think the 2-hour version we got is that movie. Not by a long shot.
I know they are very unpopular, but I watched a fan-edit that worked a lot of the supplemental marketing material that was available and even a few of the deleted scenes back into the film and it was pretty damn good.
Trust me, if you do end up watching those videos, you're going to hate the guy who made them because he comes off like a know-it-all dick, haha. And I really wish he could have just made a normal video because it's a lot of interesting and useful information.
I haven't watched the vid yet - but I wish a lot of the supplemental material (marketing, deleted scenes, prior script drafts, etc.) that I have heard some people draw on made its way to the screen!
I have a similar reaction sometimes with the extensive bonus materials with Peter Jackson's Hobbit movies - there will be some crucial piece of information that would have really helped the narrative buried like an hour-and-a-half into a three-hour behind-the-scenes doc. I wanna scream "That's a really cool idea Peter Jackson - you should have put that in the fucking movie!!!"