Alien: Covenant (Ridley Scott, May 19th 2017) Movie • Page 16

I'd like to start by saying that I'm much more concerned with my visceral reaction to movies, shows, etc... so my brushing over of what I consider non-important plot decisions or plot holes is just that I don't think they're a big deal when the point of a movie or show like this is to affect you emotionally and leave you with thoughts on the themes and questions of the movies' philosophy instead of questioning futuristic technology or something similar.

I agree, the visuals are fantastic in both.

David is the most important and crucial character in this (and Covenant) and I agree that all of his scenes are amazing. The idea of what he is and what he decides to do is intriguing and surprising and Fassbender kicks ass once again.

More thoughts on the Weyland stuff below...

I think that this is so far into the future that doing deep space exploration and freelance jobs like this must be so commonplace that it's practically ho-hum at this point, so them accepting a job with an enormous paycheck isn't that big of a deal. Half of them are obsessed scientists who know that if they're doing a job this in depth it's going to be something important and the other half are like the geologist where it's literally just big $$$ in their heads so they're like "fuck it, put me to sleep" and just go along.

Even if they did switch it up and included the TED Talk before the cave scene or wherever and showed all those people watch that then sign a paper then show them getting on board and going to sleep, etc... is something like that really that much better than what we got? Maybe, maybe not, but I don't think something that mundane is enough to derail an entire film. What is gained or lost really?

I'm sure that the majority of all sci-fi movies have something similar to being "lucky" and landing near to the location they were wanting to go, so I don't know why this is a nitpick in this movie and not others. And I imagine that if they're able to locate that specific cluster of stars however many lightyears away it is, then they're able to say "the angle from which this cluster is must have been viewed from roughly this area of this planet during this time of 'day'" and they had a general area to land.

And the captain landing there? Look at the area it landed. It's a giant runway for spaceships in general, so landing there with the thought they might have to high-tail it out of there at some point not only makes sense but happens later in the movie anyways.

There are tons of decisions in this movie that people call out as being stupid or unbelievably dumb coming from scientists, but again, this is just a trope of practically every other sci-fi or horror movie ever made. Don't go back into the scary basement by yourself, don't split up the team, you probably shouldn't investigate that weird noise you heard, or in Alien itself you shouldn't go back for a stupid cat when it could potentially lead to bringing back Alien life to your home planet! Haha

I can see how people think those decisions are stupid but without decisions like these, then we don't have a movie.

What I get out of Prometheus, other than the visuals and score and appreciating the performances, is the philosophical questions that are summed up pretty damn well here:

We're all searching for where we came from, why were we created, what's the next step in our evolution (which I believe it's David-like androids for everyone and their consciousness), and then David knowing he himself is essentially Human 2.0 and that it's up to him to create and/or discover the next step in evolution. And I find that fascinating.

One other quick thing I've read and think is possibly the best visual of the movie is that the engineers were designed to mimic the look of Michelangelo's David, the Statue of Liberty, and Elvis. The way the engineers look were imprinted in our DNA from millions or billions of years ago and that's why similar looking faces appear in our art throughout history or even re-appear in actual peoples' faces and what possibly could draw people to be more interested in someone like Elvis; because we see our creators in that face.

None of this should read as an attack on your opinion of course, haha, I just find this movie incredibly interesting to talk about!

 

I don't think it works that way Disney is all about that box office money. I'd love to be wrong though.

 

And now I want to watch Covenant again to do a similar post about why I love that one. Might try to do that one night this week.

 

I will say @Brother Beck that the only scene that I truly think is pure steaming shit that should have been removed is the sex scene. It it's a pathetic way to distract the characters. I hate that scene.

 

I think part of the reason Disney bought 21st Century Fox (besides building up a huge inventory for streaming) was to diversify their movie offerings. I think they'll still produce movies like this under the 21st Century banner.

 

Yeah it just sucks that the Alien and Predator franchise both had box office flops so recently. I wouldn't be surprised if Disney ever did a new movie or reboot, it'd be waaaayy down the road to put distance in between.

 

I haven't seen Prometheus in a long time, but I enjoyed it the last time I saw it. The most common "dumb thing that happens" complaints I usually see around it are "why did the animal expert touch the snake", "how come the map guy got lost" and "why did they run in a straight line?". I dunno, those things probably could have been executed a little better, but they've never really bothered me. Some of my favorite movies are filled with little conveniences like that. It's hard to find blockbusters without them.

 

I saw this thread bumped assuming you guys were talking about this

High school 'Alien' play the talk of Hollywood - CNN

 

I think another reason people didn't like Prometheus is because going into any new movie and expecting or hoping it to live up to the original, which is widely considered one of the greatest horror and/or sci-fi movies ever created, is practically a near impossible bar to reach.

 

I don't know how I would have felt going into the theater experience, but I'd watch Aliens and Judgement Day over the originals any day.

 

That play looks awesome.

 

I'd absolutely prefer Judgement Day over the original as well, but Alien is just something else. Outside of 2001: A Space Odyssey, I'd be hard-pressed to find a better sci-fi.

 

I don't take any of this as an attack, I love the conversation. I wanted to love Prometheus so badly. I am a huge fan of sci-fi movies and I love when they are done with a big budget and good cast, I am a pretty big fan of Ridley Scott and I like the Alien movies a lot. If I just thought this movie was shit with no redeeming qualities I wouldn't be writing in-depth analyses of it online 5+ years later haha.

When I rewatched most of the movie this morning I tried to keep a completely open mind and forget all of the problems I had with the film before. I tried to identify where it went wrong for me because I know a lot of other films are loaded with the same types of coincidences, characters acting dumb, etc., but for whatever reason for me with this film they completely take me out of it and derail the entire movie. I am not sure why with Alien: Covenant (Alien Covenant ?) I was able to just go along for the ride and enjoy it despite thinking the entire time that it is not a good Alien movie at all - maybe my problems with Prometheus tempered my expectations...? I feel like I wanted Prometheus to be amazing and profound on the level of like 2001: A Space Odyssey when for me it ended up being on par with Event Horizon. I guess with Covenant I knew a little more heading in about what I was gonna be getting.

 

This play does look amazing! It looks like something Jason Schwartzman's character would put on in Rushmore haha.

 

It's 'Alien: Covenant" which is super lame; they should have just kept the naming convention of Promethus and called it Covenant and be done with it, lol

The more and more I think about it, it's the expectations people had that tainted Prometheus. I wouldn't be surprised at all if the small connections to Alien were removed, which would be very easy to do, and it was just released as a new Ridley Scott sci-fi that people would have liked it quite a bit more. And would have been more focused on philosophy and story rather than subconsciously been like, "where's the xenomorph???"

Great convo!

 

Wasn't the original title to this called Paradise or something? They probably ditched the title when Ridley decided in the middle of shooting that he didn't want to continue the story of Promethus and wanted to do another Alien movie.

 

I'm pretty sure it was always Covenant and then they made him put Alien: at the front.

 

I dunno why I just didn't google it haha.

On September 24, Scott disclosed the film's title as Alien: Paradise Lost.[33] In November 2015, Scott revealed the new title to be Alien: Covenant, and filming was set to begin in February 2016 in Australia.[34]

I guess it was always meant to have Alien in the title.

 

Yeah it was originally Alien: Paradise Lost I think

 

Yikes, that's a bad title, haha

What's funny is that I was reading the Wikipedia for Prometheus right as your quote notification brought me here and there's a good amount of references to Dante's Paradise Lost in that movie.

 

Damn, I need to watch all of the Alien movies again now. Every time I think or read about them, they just get me all hyped up. It might be my favorite movie franchise universe at this point.

 

I'd place it in the top of mine too along with Rocky (Creed 1 and 2 count!).

I know I'll get shit for it, but Underworld (minus movie 5) is up there for me too!

 

I've never seen any of the Underworld movies, but Creed is as good as any of the Rocky movies and minus a stinker or two, those are incredibly well done movies.

 

Give em a watch!

And yeah I would argue the later Rocky movies are the best, but I love them all. Rocky 6, Rocky 7 (Creed) and Rocky 8 (Creed II) are my favorites.

 

I still need to see Creed II. Creed is the best of the franchise in my opinion, but Rocky IV is my favorite. It's just so ridiculous. I love it.