1977 in film. • Page 3

what a beyond stupid conversation damn

 

Ah probably.... That'll be why I didn't notice it until recently then!

 

This is a valid point—that being conscious of this sort of thing takes work, and keeping informed, and sometimes you have to sacrifice your relationship with the art. It doesn’t mean it never impacted you.

All that said... There are also SO many other films and artists that aren’t problematic. It’s not THAT hard to seek them out. I really don’t think continuous praise, like naming Allen as a favorite, is helpful in making progress at all.

 

Not a very nuanced take on my part, but I'm glad I saw Annie Hall, Manhattan, and Crimes and Misdemeanors when I was younger. They're definitely a part of film history. I mean, Annie Hall won five Oscars, including best picture. I recall seeing Midnight in Paris in theaters and liking it, before I was aware of the controversy around Woody Allen.

I have zero interest in seeing any new Woody Allen movies or going back through his filmography (or watching any Mia Farrow movies, for that matter), but I don't hold it against anyone if they list one of his old movies as a favorite from a particular year.

 

Yeah I mean, I'm not saying give him a lifetime achievement Oscar or anything, I'm just some no-name dude on a niche message board in a thread of like 20 people saying one of his movies is my second favorite movie of a specific year. I also get why other people wouldn't.

 

fuck them all too? it's not hard to say lol

 

Wild how the simple (and non-controversial) statement of "Fuck Annie Hall" is such an incendiary take.

 

so why the silence in the last 16 threads but jumping in to shame people here

 

This is really just excusing yourself when you know you could do better. One person's opinion validates another's and so on. Progress can be incremental, believe it or not, and what you say does matter.

 

If it'll make you happy I'll go back and post in all the other threads as well.

I didn't even participate in these threads until the last couple years because I typically can't stand how this forum talks about movies but I decided to anyway. Definitely regretting that decision now though.

 

Because this is the first of these threads I've been a part of?

 

Wasn't referring to you, I see that you're new to the exercise.

 

There’s also the complexity that’s worth noting that even Woody Allen movies aren’t one-man-shows. Some of the greatest performances of legends like Diane Keaton, Dianne Wiest, etc are in his movies. Gordon Willis’ cinematography in Manhattan is a gold standard. It’s not inherently immoral to suffer the work of a bad person for reasons that aren’t direct, contrarian support of said bad person.

 

We're also talking about some of the greatest films of the decade/this year. Like, Annie Hall, fucked as it is, does has a part in that discussion. It's not like it was without reason or random.

 

Many of the people involved in Allen films have publicly denounced their work in these films.

 

Yeah..nobody said it was hard to say??? In fact, I already did say it???

 

They haven't publicly denounced the quality of their work...just the fact that they did the work in the first place.

 

so...why the long drawn out conversation about what I said originally, which was simply "Fuck Annie Hall", and over what @OotyPa said, as someone who was in one of these threads for the first time?

 

This doesn't even make sense.

I have better things to do than try and convince y'all to quit supporting a child molester by naming him one of the best of all time. Out of here

 

Which part

 

i also do think there’s a shade of difference between a film made by a notorious pedophile and abuser that essentially popularized auteur theory in which he was involved in every step of the making of the film and would do so in subsequent films, including those essentially about him as a pedophile and abuser, and a film made by a team about political events a lot of the country might not have had been informed on starring an abuser

but maybe that’s just me

 

I mean, if we’re acting like these meaningless threads have any actual bearing on the abusers involved in the film gaining/keeping power...why split hairs?


Of course, they don’t

 

Old POS aside, currently enjoying the image of people in 1976 wondering who the heck that Nixon guy was and what happened to him.

 

Also, to be clear, fuck Woody Allen and Hoffman and Dreyfuss etc. I think everyone agrees about that. Shaming people or calling them disgusting for ranking movies in a thread that like 5 people participate in just kinda seems meaningless, especially if you’re also going to rank movies with abusers in them

 

I think a piece of the conversation over the weekend in the accountability thread was that there’s a more productive way to discuss accountability than “Fuck ____”.

Especially in the context of threads like these, wherein (mostly) males celebrate the genius cinematic feats of (mostly) males, aggression is poor allyship and anti-introspective.

Like it or not, film history is riddled with violence, sexism, sexual violence, white supremacy, racism, patriarchy, consumerism, transphobia, homophobia and countless other oppressions and affirmations of the status quo.

I don’t think it’s enough to say “fuck woody allen”. Why did (or do) his movies connect with so many people?